--
Lars wrote:
>>>Interesting. I'm guessing Al Taliaferro drew Donald and Huey, Dewey and
Louie, while Dick Moores drew the others. Or am I completely wrong on
this?>>>
You are right. Al might have pencilled Pluto too since he and the ducks are
all pencilled with bluepen. Anyway: Moores seems to have inked Pluto and all
of the non ducks.
/Joakim.
Author
Topic: 200602
(32 messages)
Gunnarsson, Joakim SE - HMJ
Al and Dick
Message 1 -
2006-02-01 at 18:09:46
Goofy313g
Douglas married to a mrs Loon / HDL's father and Daisy's brother
Message 2 -
2006-02-01 at 23:13:49
Thanks a lot, Lars, for your very clear and complete answer!!!
Lars:
>>>I still feel bad about having contradicted that tree (and yours, for
>>>that matter). But it had to be done for the good of the story and for
>>>the good of the character.
Well, I forgive you, my tree just looks a little bit messier :-)
I think you were right to make this choice, I already thought about it before
reading your message, and i really told to myself that, after all, Douglas
and whitewater fit really well together as a pair like Scrooge and Donald so
you're confinrming what i thought.
I'd really love to read this story!!!
And the coherence of one story is much more important than the work of the
work of a simple fan such as me, and even of the work of Don Rosa, who told
several times he considered himself more like a Barks-fan than like an artist
(even though he's a great artist, to me :-)) And Don Rosa himslef has not been
100% faithful to barks, as he didn't show whitewater as a DISTANT cousin...
Eventually, i'd say that this inconsistency you almost made could be
considered as following Disney comics pure tradition, as it's common to see the same
characer in a different role from one story to another (like aunt Agatha being
once mickey's aunt, and another time Minnie's aunt...), and that somehow makes
this universe even more interresting, like in greek mythology, in which
Hephaistos split Zeus' head with an axis which made Zeus be able to give birth to
Athena, and where we later learn that Hera gave birth to Hephaistos himself on
her own because she was jealous that Zeus had Athena alone...
>>>I seriously doubt *anybody* would want to marry Douglas.
well, we don't know much of Lulubelle Loon's personnality, but Fethry seems
to have inherited this wacky personnality from his mother's side, so maybe a
female version of fethry like his mother or in this case his mother's sister
would be crazy enough to marry him... I don't know which one of them would be
more exasperating, but i'd love to see them together :-)
Or maybe she's dead and that's why Douglas became even more bad-tempered...
>>>I still think it's a mistake to make HDL's father into the brother of
>>>Daisy, but, hey, it's your tree...
Exactly, it's MY tree!!!
more seriously, I like this idea, and there are several coincidental facts
that go in the same direction...
*First, there is the opinion of Don Rosa that should be enough for some
people :-)
*Then, in the cartoon "Donald's Diary", we get to meet Daisy's brothers who
looks a lot like Huey, Dewey and Louie, thus one of them could be the father (I
know some people will see them as HDL playing a role, but why wouldn't they
play the role of their father and uncles?)
*Then, in Mark Worden's family tree, HDL's Father seems to have been taken
from Barks' "Double Masquerade", in which this character has two twin brothers
-which could be the reason why Worden chose this duck rather than another)
*Then, HDL often refer to Daisy as "aunt Daisy"
*Daisy appeared just after the nephews in Donald's life, so we can wonder if
Donald Daisy didn't become close to eachother when Daisy saw this guy taking
care of her nephews, while she could have done the same and adopt them and
didn't... Maybe that's a reason why she loves donald that much, despite his bad
temper, that was an occasion for her to see how much of a good person he is
inside and how much he raised them well, all alone.
*That would also explain why she sometimes defend the kids from Donald during
quarrels.
*Daisy's cousin Gandy from "The Chatterbox" looks a lot like HDL
*Eventually, there is this coincidental similarity between Daisy's father
from "Donald's diary", and the nephew's granduncle upsy Duck from "Mastering the
matterhorn"...
Why do you think it's a mistake? is this because it could be considered like
incest, or because you just don't feel it that way?
Gilles
Lars:
>>>I still feel bad about having contradicted that tree (and yours, for
>>>that matter). But it had to be done for the good of the story and for
>>>the good of the character.
Well, I forgive you, my tree just looks a little bit messier :-)
I think you were right to make this choice, I already thought about it before
reading your message, and i really told to myself that, after all, Douglas
and whitewater fit really well together as a pair like Scrooge and Donald so
you're confinrming what i thought.
I'd really love to read this story!!!
And the coherence of one story is much more important than the work of the
work of a simple fan such as me, and even of the work of Don Rosa, who told
several times he considered himself more like a Barks-fan than like an artist
(even though he's a great artist, to me :-)) And Don Rosa himslef has not been
100% faithful to barks, as he didn't show whitewater as a DISTANT cousin...
Eventually, i'd say that this inconsistency you almost made could be
considered as following Disney comics pure tradition, as it's common to see the same
characer in a different role from one story to another (like aunt Agatha being
once mickey's aunt, and another time Minnie's aunt...), and that somehow makes
this universe even more interresting, like in greek mythology, in which
Hephaistos split Zeus' head with an axis which made Zeus be able to give birth to
Athena, and where we later learn that Hera gave birth to Hephaistos himself on
her own because she was jealous that Zeus had Athena alone...
>>>I seriously doubt *anybody* would want to marry Douglas.
well, we don't know much of Lulubelle Loon's personnality, but Fethry seems
to have inherited this wacky personnality from his mother's side, so maybe a
female version of fethry like his mother or in this case his mother's sister
would be crazy enough to marry him... I don't know which one of them would be
more exasperating, but i'd love to see them together :-)
Or maybe she's dead and that's why Douglas became even more bad-tempered...
>>>I still think it's a mistake to make HDL's father into the brother of
>>>Daisy, but, hey, it's your tree...
Exactly, it's MY tree!!!
more seriously, I like this idea, and there are several coincidental facts
that go in the same direction...
*First, there is the opinion of Don Rosa that should be enough for some
people :-)
*Then, in the cartoon "Donald's Diary", we get to meet Daisy's brothers who
looks a lot like Huey, Dewey and Louie, thus one of them could be the father (I
know some people will see them as HDL playing a role, but why wouldn't they
play the role of their father and uncles?)
*Then, in Mark Worden's family tree, HDL's Father seems to have been taken
from Barks' "Double Masquerade", in which this character has two twin brothers
-which could be the reason why Worden chose this duck rather than another)
*Then, HDL often refer to Daisy as "aunt Daisy"
*Daisy appeared just after the nephews in Donald's life, so we can wonder if
Donald Daisy didn't become close to eachother when Daisy saw this guy taking
care of her nephews, while she could have done the same and adopt them and
didn't... Maybe that's a reason why she loves donald that much, despite his bad
temper, that was an occasion for her to see how much of a good person he is
inside and how much he raised them well, all alone.
*That would also explain why she sometimes defend the kids from Donald during
quarrels.
*Daisy's cousin Gandy from "The Chatterbox" looks a lot like HDL
*Eventually, there is this coincidental similarity between Daisy's father
from "Donald's diary", and the nephew's granduncle upsy Duck from "Mastering the
matterhorn"...
Why do you think it's a mistake? is this because it could be considered like
incest, or because you just don't feel it that way?
Gilles
H.W.Fluks
Carl Barks Street (Almere)
Message 3 -
2006-02-03 at 11:12:22
On a recent map of the Dutch town Almere, I saw a street named after
Carl Barks.
The street is in a newly built area. Streets are named after comic
characters and comic creators.
The Dutch comicologist Kees Kousemaker (www.lambiek.net) helped the
Almere people with the street names.
One of the other streets is named after Carol Voges.
I'm not sure the street is already really existing. Maybe it's only on
the map and has to be built later.
When I have the chance, I'll have a look in Almere and make some photos.
BTW, is there anywhere else in the world a street named after Barks?
(Apart from the street sign "Nash & Barks" that used to be in Walt
Disney World.)
--Harry.
"Wie ben ik? Wat doe ik hier? Waar is mijn Roddelflop?"
Carl Barks.
The street is in a newly built area. Streets are named after comic
characters and comic creators.
The Dutch comicologist Kees Kousemaker (www.lambiek.net) helped the
Almere people with the street names.
One of the other streets is named after Carol Voges.
I'm not sure the street is already really existing. Maybe it's only on
the map and has to be built later.
When I have the chance, I'll have a look in Almere and make some photos.
BTW, is there anywhere else in the world a street named after Barks?
(Apart from the street sign "Nash & Barks" that used to be in Walt
Disney World.)
--Harry.
"Wie ben ik? Wat doe ik hier? Waar is mijn Roddelflop?"
Olaf Solstrand
Carl Barks Street (Almere)
Message 4 -
2006-02-03 at 11:42:39
<H.W.Fluks at telecom.tno.nl> skreiv Fri, 03 Feb 2006 10:12:22 +0100
> BTW, is there anywhere else in the world a street named after Barks?
> (Apart from the street sign "Nash & Barks" that used to be in Walt
> Disney World.)
There is a ?Carl Barks' Veg? in Norway. Although, it's less of a street
and more of a road stub from the main road and up to donaldist Erik
H?rthe's home, but it *is* an official road name.
And of course there's the Barks/Gottfredson cross in Duckburg, Calisota.
> BTW, is there anywhere else in the world a street named after Barks?
> (Apart from the street sign "Nash & Barks" that used to be in Walt
> Disney World.)
There is a ?Carl Barks' Veg? in Norway. Although, it's less of a street
and more of a road stub from the main road and up to donaldist Erik
H?rthe's home, but it *is* an official road name.
And of course there's the Barks/Gottfredson cross in Duckburg, Calisota.
H.W.Fluks
Carl Barks Street (Almere)
Message 5 -
2006-02-03 at 14:09:50
I wrote:
> On a recent map of the Dutch town Almere, I saw a street named after
> Carl Barks.
Here's a picture from Mapquest.com:
http://bolderbast.inducks.org/pics/almere.jpg
Streets are named after Carl Barks, Marten Toonder, Carol Voges, Henk
Albers, and other creators. Plus lots of popular comic characters.
Barks seems to be the only non-Dutch person in the neighbourhood.
(Though I think some Belgian creators are mentioned, more to the west.)
--Harry.
> On a recent map of the Dutch town Almere, I saw a street named after
> Carl Barks.
Here's a picture from Mapquest.com:
http://bolderbast.inducks.org/pics/almere.jpg
Streets are named after Carl Barks, Marten Toonder, Carol Voges, Henk
Albers, and other creators. Plus lots of popular comic characters.
Barks seems to be the only non-Dutch person in the neighbourhood.
(Though I think some Belgian creators are mentioned, more to the west.)
--Harry.
M Schartau
Carl Barks Street (Almere)
Message 6 -
2006-02-04 at 20:01:54
Well
There is the Carl Barks v?g in Sp?nga (Stockholm, Sweden) but this street is
not named after "our" Carl Barks but a swede Carl Bark.
/Michael
----- Original Message -----
From: <H.W.Fluks at telecom.tno.nl>
To: <dcml at stp.lingfil.uu.se>
Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 10:12 AM
Subject: Carl Barks Street (Almere)
| On a recent map of the Dutch town Almere, I saw a street named after
| Carl Barks.
| The street is in a newly built area. Streets are named after comic
| characters and comic creators.
| The Dutch comicologist Kees Kousemaker (www.lambiek.net) helped the
| Almere people with the street names.
| One of the other streets is named after Carol Voges.
|
| I'm not sure the street is already really existing. Maybe it's only on
| the map and has to be built later.
| When I have the chance, I'll have a look in Almere and make some photos.
|
| BTW, is there anywhere else in the world a street named after Barks?
| (Apart from the street sign "Nash & Barks" that used to be in Walt
| Disney World.)
|
| --Harry.
| "Wie ben ik? Wat doe ik hier? Waar is mijn Roddelflop?"
|
| _______________________________________________
| http://stp.ling.uu.se/mailman/listinfo/dcml
|
There is the Carl Barks v?g in Sp?nga (Stockholm, Sweden) but this street is
not named after "our" Carl Barks but a swede Carl Bark.
/Michael
----- Original Message -----
From: <H.W.Fluks at telecom.tno.nl>
To: <dcml at stp.lingfil.uu.se>
Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 10:12 AM
Subject: Carl Barks Street (Almere)
| On a recent map of the Dutch town Almere, I saw a street named after
| Carl Barks.
| The street is in a newly built area. Streets are named after comic
| characters and comic creators.
| The Dutch comicologist Kees Kousemaker (www.lambiek.net) helped the
| Almere people with the street names.
| One of the other streets is named after Carol Voges.
|
| I'm not sure the street is already really existing. Maybe it's only on
| the map and has to be built later.
| When I have the chance, I'll have a look in Almere and make some photos.
|
| BTW, is there anywhere else in the world a street named after Barks?
| (Apart from the street sign "Nash & Barks" that used to be in Walt
| Disney World.)
|
| --Harry.
| "Wie ben ik? Wat doe ik hier? Waar is mijn Roddelflop?"
|
| _______________________________________________
| http://stp.ling.uu.se/mailman/listinfo/dcml
|
JOHN CHADWICK
Not Disney comics of interest
Message 7 -
2006-02-05 at 03:10:25
Fantagraphics will be publishing Our Gang Vol. 1 in April. It collects comics written by Disney vets Walt Kelly and Carl Barks.
M.J. Prior
Disney vets
Message 8 -
2006-02-06 at 18:20:11
John Chadwick wrote:
> It collects comics written by Disney vets Walt Kelly and Carl Barks.
Barks and Kelly originally were veterinarians? I never
knew that! So maybe that's why they ended up doing animal
comics!
Michiel Prior. ;)
> It collects comics written by Disney vets Walt Kelly and Carl Barks.
Barks and Kelly originally were veterinarians? I never
knew that! So maybe that's why they ended up doing animal
comics!
Michiel Prior. ;)
Asaramelli
Disney Characteres Streets - another curiosity
Message 9 -
2006-02-06 at 19:20:37
Hello Harry !
I saw your message about the Carl Barks Street, and I verified if
in S?o Paulo we have any street with the name Carl Barks.
I didn?t found, but we have in S?o Paulo :
Rua Walt Disney, in Santo Andr? ( a small city in the metropolitan area).
And :
Rua Tio Patinhas, Rua Mickey, Rua Minie, Rua Banz?, Rua Gast?o, and Rua
Clarabela , in a same district : Ferraz de Vasconcelos
( another small city in the metropolitan area) .
I?m, going to see with my friends if we find any "Carl Barks Street", in
another brazilian city, and I send for you some photos.
Alexandre Saramelli
S?o Paulo - Brasil
Inducks indexer.
I saw your message about the Carl Barks Street, and I verified if
in S?o Paulo we have any street with the name Carl Barks.
I didn?t found, but we have in S?o Paulo :
Rua Walt Disney, in Santo Andr? ( a small city in the metropolitan area).
And :
Rua Tio Patinhas, Rua Mickey, Rua Minie, Rua Banz?, Rua Gast?o, and Rua
Clarabela , in a same district : Ferraz de Vasconcelos
( another small city in the metropolitan area) .
I?m, going to see with my friends if we find any "Carl Barks Street", in
another brazilian city, and I send for you some photos.
Alexandre Saramelli
S?o Paulo - Brasil
Inducks indexer.
Larry Giver
Don Rosa's "Seven minus Four Caballeros"
Message 10 -
2006-02-11 at 23:03:21
I just finished reading the final segment of Don's second
Caballeros story, in Gemstone's latest issue #665. It was
lots of fun when Donald makes offhand reference to several
previous stories, and his friends say they believe him, no
matter how unbelieveable it seems to them. Unfortunately,
Donald said the Mines of King Solomon are in Arabia (Part 3,
page 6, panel 5). This is not a Barks fact; in US19, page 8,
panel 1, Barks located the ducks on the western side of the
Red Sea, across from Jidda (panel 4). Jidda is in Saudi Arabia
on the east side of the Red Sea, close to Mecca. The western
shore at this latitude is in Sudan, just south of the border with
Egypt. From the coast the ducks went inland into the hills,
and found the mines of King Solomon perhaps in the
Nubian desert, Sudan.
Best wishes, Larry Giver.
Caballeros story, in Gemstone's latest issue #665. It was
lots of fun when Donald makes offhand reference to several
previous stories, and his friends say they believe him, no
matter how unbelieveable it seems to them. Unfortunately,
Donald said the Mines of King Solomon are in Arabia (Part 3,
page 6, panel 5). This is not a Barks fact; in US19, page 8,
panel 1, Barks located the ducks on the western side of the
Red Sea, across from Jidda (panel 4). Jidda is in Saudi Arabia
on the east side of the Red Sea, close to Mecca. The western
shore at this latitude is in Sudan, just south of the border with
Egypt. From the coast the ducks went inland into the hills,
and found the mines of King Solomon perhaps in the
Nubian desert, Sudan.
Best wishes, Larry Giver.
Mickey
Don Rosa's "Seven minus Four Caballeros"
Message 11 -
2006-02-12 at 13:12:54
Larry:
> Donald said the Mines of King Solomon are in Arabia (Part 3,page 6, panel
> 5). This is not a Barks fact
Details: do you really want Donald to be geographically precise, after all
he's seen and done? ^_-
Mickey
> Donald said the Mines of King Solomon are in Arabia (Part 3,page 6, panel
> 5). This is not a Barks fact
Details: do you really want Donald to be geographically precise, after all
he's seen and done? ^_-
Mickey
Ole Damgaard
Donaldist Society meeting : photos
Message 12 -
2006-02-12 at 15:32:52
Photos from the Danish Donaldist Societys winter meeting february 4-5 here:
http://snipurl.com/mhbn
It was fun!
/ole
http://snipurl.com/mhbn
It was fun!
/ole
Larry Giver
Mines of Solomon and Sheba
Message 13 -
2006-02-13 at 19:44:02
In reply to Mickey:
Yes, probably Donald Duck's memory is slipping!
I hadn't thought of that, but the ducks went to both the
Mines of King Solomon and also the mines of the
Queen of Sheba (US55, "McDuck of Arabia"), which are
indeed in Arabia. Donald must have confused the two;
after all, those two characters are closely linked in
history.
----Larry Giver.
Yes, probably Donald Duck's memory is slipping!
I hadn't thought of that, but the ducks went to both the
Mines of King Solomon and also the mines of the
Queen of Sheba (US55, "McDuck of Arabia"), which are
indeed in Arabia. Donald must have confused the two;
after all, those two characters are closely linked in
history.
----Larry Giver.
Vidar
My homepage
Message 14 -
2006-02-14 at 22:43:04
I've moved my homepage to http://vidarland.com
The disney comics-related page are:
The Junior Woodchucks: http://www.vidarland.com/?q=/en/node/28
Duckburg Religion: http://www.vidarland.com/?q=/en/node/33
Deafness in Comics: http://www.vidarland.com/?q=/en/node/48
(the server may be a little slow)
The disney comics-related page are:
The Junior Woodchucks: http://www.vidarland.com/?q=/en/node/28
Duckburg Religion: http://www.vidarland.com/?q=/en/node/33
Deafness in Comics: http://www.vidarland.com/?q=/en/node/48
(the server may be a little slow)
Olaf Solstrand
"Lydia" censored in US?
Message 15 -
2006-02-17 at 15:36:37
Friends, Lydians, Donaldists,
I was wondering if anyone here has any knowledge about whether the lyrics
of "Lydia the tattooed lady" in Don Rosa's story "The Treasury of Croesus"
have been censored in the American publication? With that I mean; have the
lyrics been changed in the process from the original Egmont script to what
was actually printed in WDC&S 601/602/603?
Looking at the Gladstone books now, the lyrics printed are:
"Lydia, oh Lydia, say have you met Lydia? Lydia the taattoooed lady!"
"Say, have you met Lydia..."
"Lydia, oh Lydia, that encyclopedia..."
"You can learn a lot from Lydia!"
"Lydia, oh, Lydia, say have you met..."
"Lydia, oh Lydia, oh have you seen Lydia! Lydia the tatooed lady!"
"Lydia, oh Lydia, say have you met Lydia?"
Of course, all of these lines ARE in the Groucho Marx lyrics, so what
makes me wonder whether anything has been censored? Well, the Norwegian
translation. The Norwegian translation of these lyrics contains some lines
with such semi-erotic content that it seems VERY unlikely to me that all
the lines in the Norwegian lyrics came from the head of the translator
based on the lines I quote above.
Among these lines are:
-- "Mannfolk faller om som fluer n?r de skuer hennes buer"
("Men fall like flies when they see her curves")
-- "Lydia, Lydia, hun viser deg omkring; Hun har hele atlaset p? kroppen;
For en krone f?r du se Paris eller Beijing; For en femmer f?r du
Sukkertoppen"
("Lydia, Lydia shows you around; She has the whole atlas on her body; For
one krone [norw. currency] she'll show you Paris or Beijing; For five
she'll show you Sugarloaf Mountain")
-- "Her g?r Hannibal p? elefanttur over fjellet; Bak ham g?r Napoleon med
kaker han vil selge"
("Here goes Hannibal on an elephant ride over the mountain; behind him is
Napoleon with cakes he wants to sell")
...of course, I realize that none of these lines resemble anything in the
original lyrics of the song. But still, considering the relatively sensual
style of my first two examples, and the "celebrity aspect" of the last
one, not to mention the amount of variation here (while the American
lyrics pretty much are one or two lines over and over again), it feels
somehow unrealistic that the Norwegian translator took all of this out of
nowhere. Especially not when considering there _are_ parts of the Marx
song which it seems more likely that inspired the Norwegian lyrics (e.g.
the line "Mannfolk faller om som fluer n?r de skuer hennes buer" has the
same rhytm as "She has eyes that men adore so and here torso even more
so", plus they both have a little sensuality in them.
So what has happened here -- does anyone know? Were the words just too
filthy for Gladstone to print, or were they simply never in there in the
first place, meaning the Norwegian translator was a creative genius?
(that Sugarloaf Mountain verse is one of the funniest things I've ever
read in a Disney comic.)
Tata,
Olaf the Blue
www.andebyonline.com :: www.olafsolstrand.no
I was wondering if anyone here has any knowledge about whether the lyrics
of "Lydia the tattooed lady" in Don Rosa's story "The Treasury of Croesus"
have been censored in the American publication? With that I mean; have the
lyrics been changed in the process from the original Egmont script to what
was actually printed in WDC&S 601/602/603?
Looking at the Gladstone books now, the lyrics printed are:
"Lydia, oh Lydia, say have you met Lydia? Lydia the taattoooed lady!"
"Say, have you met Lydia..."
"Lydia, oh Lydia, that encyclopedia..."
"You can learn a lot from Lydia!"
"Lydia, oh, Lydia, say have you met..."
"Lydia, oh Lydia, oh have you seen Lydia! Lydia the tatooed lady!"
"Lydia, oh Lydia, say have you met Lydia?"
Of course, all of these lines ARE in the Groucho Marx lyrics, so what
makes me wonder whether anything has been censored? Well, the Norwegian
translation. The Norwegian translation of these lyrics contains some lines
with such semi-erotic content that it seems VERY unlikely to me that all
the lines in the Norwegian lyrics came from the head of the translator
based on the lines I quote above.
Among these lines are:
-- "Mannfolk faller om som fluer n?r de skuer hennes buer"
("Men fall like flies when they see her curves")
-- "Lydia, Lydia, hun viser deg omkring; Hun har hele atlaset p? kroppen;
For en krone f?r du se Paris eller Beijing; For en femmer f?r du
Sukkertoppen"
("Lydia, Lydia shows you around; She has the whole atlas on her body; For
one krone [norw. currency] she'll show you Paris or Beijing; For five
she'll show you Sugarloaf Mountain")
-- "Her g?r Hannibal p? elefanttur over fjellet; Bak ham g?r Napoleon med
kaker han vil selge"
("Here goes Hannibal on an elephant ride over the mountain; behind him is
Napoleon with cakes he wants to sell")
...of course, I realize that none of these lines resemble anything in the
original lyrics of the song. But still, considering the relatively sensual
style of my first two examples, and the "celebrity aspect" of the last
one, not to mention the amount of variation here (while the American
lyrics pretty much are one or two lines over and over again), it feels
somehow unrealistic that the Norwegian translator took all of this out of
nowhere. Especially not when considering there _are_ parts of the Marx
song which it seems more likely that inspired the Norwegian lyrics (e.g.
the line "Mannfolk faller om som fluer n?r de skuer hennes buer" has the
same rhytm as "She has eyes that men adore so and here torso even more
so", plus they both have a little sensuality in them.
So what has happened here -- does anyone know? Were the words just too
filthy for Gladstone to print, or were they simply never in there in the
first place, meaning the Norwegian translator was a creative genius?
(that Sugarloaf Mountain verse is one of the funniest things I've ever
read in a Disney comic.)
Tata,
Olaf the Blue
www.andebyonline.com :: www.olafsolstrand.no