I am not Mr. Leach but I am American and have lived in Europe several years (France, Italy, and Spain).
This is what I have noticed.
1- The average American youth does not read much on their own, TV, video games, computer (games mostly) and Internet surfing has displaced books as a past time. As a teacher, for many students, the only reading will be what they do in the classroom. There is no incentive for them to read on their own and consequently, they have problems reading, i.e. it is hard/slow process for them to read.
2- I have not found the broad selection of quality comic or illustrated books/magazines in the likes of Journal de Tintin (defunct), Journal de Mickey, Spirou, and all the hard cover illustrated books that included an entire story from these magazines (Adventures of Blake and Mortimer and Tintin stories come to mind).
3- Finally, the American family is going through a transition with half my students from single parent families. This, along with the stresses involved makes it difficult for the child to have a stable, mind stimulating environment. The TV (especially since "bad" TV, talk shows, confrontations, etc... replaced the children hours 1600~1800) has replaced the baby sitter or the parent at home.
I hope it helps,
Lancelot
Mr Leach,
How come Disney comincs sells so bad in the US compared
to the good numbers in Europe, among them Norway?
Ever since I first picked down a copy of Whitman's
Donald Duck and WDC&S around 30 years ago at a
newsstand, and was allowed to buy one of them, I have been an eager reader and
collector of the US Disney Comics, and followed up with subscriptions when
Gladstone took over... There ought to be a huge potential over there! I mean,
you population is above 300 millions, we are not even five, and Donald
Duck weekly sells a few 100 thousands, every week!
Erlend, Norway
Pages:
1
2
Author
Topic: 201004
(30 messages)
Guy Lapointe
[SPG, Suspected,
Message 16 -
2010-04-18 at 13:29:14
UNDBKB
Disney Sales
Message 17 -
2010-04-18 at 15:08:46
Familien Enget writes:
How come Disney comics sell so bad in the US compared to the good numbers
in Europe, among them Norway?
I guess as a Norwegian American I would have to say Norwegians are
"Smarter" than the average American!
Barry Branvold
How come Disney comics sell so bad in the US compared to the good numbers
in Europe, among them Norway?
I guess as a Norwegian American I would have to say Norwegians are
"Smarter" than the average American!
Barry Branvold
Gary Leach
Bad Sales
Message 18 -
2010-04-19 at 07:58:49
> Mr Leach,
>
> How come Disney comincs sells so bad in the US compared to the good
> numbers in Europe, among them Norway?
> Ever since I first picked down a copy of Whitman's Donald Duck and
> WDC&S around 30 years ago at a newsstand, and was allowed to buy one
> of them, I have been an eager reader and collector of the US Disney
> Comics, and followed up with subscriptions when Gladstone took
> over... There ought to be a huge potential over there! I mean, you
> population is above 300 millions, we are not even five, and Donald
> Duck weekly sells a few 100 thousands, every week!
>
> Erlend, Norway
Famelien,
Your question's not an easy one. In my own case I'd read a lot of
Disney comics as a kid (in the 1960s), but by the time I was a
teenager they'd fallen off my reading radar. Working on the Disneys at
Gladstone gave me a whole new appreciation for them, but by then the
hope of their regaining more than marginal interest to American comic
book readers was dimming fast.
Some quick and dirty history: after World War II sales of comics books
starting trending downward in the US. One response to this was to
revive the superhero genre, which is generally agreed to have started
in earnest with a new version of The Flash published by DC in 1956.
This kicked off what is now known as The Silver Age, an era that
certainly did revive superheroes--so much so that the genre pretty
much dominated the comic book medium in the US from that point onward.
(Lines like Disney and Archie and Harvey weren't out of the game by
any means, but they did get pushed more and more to the margins as The
Silver Age ran on.) This dominance was further bolstered by the
advent, in the early 1970s, of the direct-market retail distribution
model. This model served super-hero fans above all others, since these
were the bulk of American readers (including yours truly) who still
wanted comic books--by that time most of the US population had largely
forgotten that comic books were even being published.
By 1986 superheroes had to all intents and purposes become the US
comic book business, leaving bare scraps of market share to all other
genres. But here's the kicker: that sales slide for comic books in the
US that started back in the mid-1940s was never really halted, let
alone turned around, so every genre had to struggle for a slice of an
ever-dwindling pie. The sales we considered disappointing at Gladstone
for our Disney's back in the late 1980s would be welcomed today by
even DC and Marvel for more than a few of their superhero titles.
Countless articles and even books have been written about why the
American reading public soured on comic books so long ago and, on the
whole, never got back their taste for them. In the final analysis it
follows that Disney comics suffered right along with the rest.
Gary
>
> How come Disney comincs sells so bad in the US compared to the good
> numbers in Europe, among them Norway?
> Ever since I first picked down a copy of Whitman's Donald Duck and
> WDC&S around 30 years ago at a newsstand, and was allowed to buy one
> of them, I have been an eager reader and collector of the US Disney
> Comics, and followed up with subscriptions when Gladstone took
> over... There ought to be a huge potential over there! I mean, you
> population is above 300 millions, we are not even five, and Donald
> Duck weekly sells a few 100 thousands, every week!
>
> Erlend, Norway
Famelien,
Your question's not an easy one. In my own case I'd read a lot of
Disney comics as a kid (in the 1960s), but by the time I was a
teenager they'd fallen off my reading radar. Working on the Disneys at
Gladstone gave me a whole new appreciation for them, but by then the
hope of their regaining more than marginal interest to American comic
book readers was dimming fast.
Some quick and dirty history: after World War II sales of comics books
starting trending downward in the US. One response to this was to
revive the superhero genre, which is generally agreed to have started
in earnest with a new version of The Flash published by DC in 1956.
This kicked off what is now known as The Silver Age, an era that
certainly did revive superheroes--so much so that the genre pretty
much dominated the comic book medium in the US from that point onward.
(Lines like Disney and Archie and Harvey weren't out of the game by
any means, but they did get pushed more and more to the margins as The
Silver Age ran on.) This dominance was further bolstered by the
advent, in the early 1970s, of the direct-market retail distribution
model. This model served super-hero fans above all others, since these
were the bulk of American readers (including yours truly) who still
wanted comic books--by that time most of the US population had largely
forgotten that comic books were even being published.
By 1986 superheroes had to all intents and purposes become the US
comic book business, leaving bare scraps of market share to all other
genres. But here's the kicker: that sales slide for comic books in the
US that started back in the mid-1940s was never really halted, let
alone turned around, so every genre had to struggle for a slice of an
ever-dwindling pie. The sales we considered disappointing at Gladstone
for our Disney's back in the late 1980s would be welcomed today by
even DC and Marvel for more than a few of their superhero titles.
Countless articles and even books have been written about why the
American reading public soured on comic books so long ago and, on the
whole, never got back their taste for them. In the final analysis it
follows that Disney comics suffered right along with the rest.
Gary
D.M. Van Eijmeren
Don't people read anymore?
Message 19 -
2010-04-19 at 13:31:52
Question about the discussion on bad sales of Disney comics in the USA:
If people don't read anymore, why are Joanne Rowling's very thick books
about Harry Potter so popular amongst today's children? The thickness of
those books even scares me away, an old man of 36 years. :-P
The total Potter-story must be over thousands of pages long. And the kids
love to read it! How come?
--- Dani?l
If people don't read anymore, why are Joanne Rowling's very thick books
about Harry Potter so popular amongst today's children? The thickness of
those books even scares me away, an old man of 36 years. :-P
The total Potter-story must be over thousands of pages long. And the kids
love to read it! How come?
--- Dani?l
George
[SPG, Suspected,
Message 20 -
2010-04-20 at 14:40:46
I am not Mr. Leach but I am American and have lived in Europe several years (France, Italy, and Spain).
This is what I have noticed.
1- The average American youth does not read much on their own, TV, video games, computer (games mostly) and Internet surfing has displaced books as a past time. As a teacher, for many students, the only reading will be what they do in the classroom. There is no incentive for them to read on their own and consequently, they have problems reading, i.e. it is hard/slow process for them to read.
2- I have not found the broad selection of quality comic or illustrated books/magazines in the likes of Journal de Tintin (defunct), Journal de Mickey, Spirou, and all the hard cover illustrated books that included an entire story from these magazines (Adventures of Blake and Mortimer and Tintin stories come to mind).
3- Finally, the American family is going through a transition with half my students from single parent families. This, along with the stresses involved makes it difficult for the child to have a stable, mind stimulating environment. The TV (especially since "bad" TV, talk shows, confrontations, etc... replaced the children hours 1600~1800) has replaced the baby sitter or the parent at home.
I hope it helps,
Lancelot
Actually, I would like to disagree with that. Maybe it's just the area you're in. I don't collect comic books much, but I buy the collections and treasuries. Not because of the price and availability, but because of the durability. Hardbound and "soft cover" treasuries and collections just last longer for me and finding the actual older comic books would be very difficult. And with a 5 year old and 9 year old + their friends reading them, I need the durability factor. If they asked me to order a subscription, I would. But my first personal choice to be bought is any collection that I haven't bought yet.
As to kids not getting out from in front of the brain drain machine, I live in a pretty bad area. Over half the kids in my town are disadvantaged and many of them stay at my home more then they do at their house since there is no one there for them. But out of the 25-30 kids in the area under the age of 12, a sizable fraction of my older Disney collection (10-15 books) are constantly borrowed to read on their own time with more kids waiting for the books to be returned so they can borrow them. The newer collections (1995-present) don't seem to get borrowed so much, but the older Disney collections always out enough that I've been planning on finding and buying second books to stay in my library. And it's not only Disney comic collections that are asked for. The Richard Halliburton collections, Tom Swift Jr, and older Hardy Boys and Nancy Drews, as well as many others are being borrowed as well. Some kids may have never been introduced to good reading, I have to agree. But there seems (at least in my area) a lack of things kids will read that they enjoy. After reading the above when it came into my email, I asked one of the kids why he came to my place to borrow books (2 Hardy Boys and Carl Barks 1978 Mickey Mouse collection) and he told me that the books I had were more enjoyable then the ones in the library........ With an answer like that, I'll keep lending them out as much as they want me to. If the books becomes too worn or damaged to give out, I'll replace them if I can find them.
G.E. Craig
BTW, while I'm here in my second post to the newsletter..... Is there a good site that list older collections? Right now, my collecting process is very shoddy. If I see a collection and I recognize that I don't own it, I try to buy it if it's for sale ($230 for a unopened/perfect Carl Barks Donald Duck (1978?).... Yikes!!!! But I bought it for a non-lendable book), but I know there are gaps in what I have and what has been issued.
This is what I have noticed.
1- The average American youth does not read much on their own, TV, video games, computer (games mostly) and Internet surfing has displaced books as a past time. As a teacher, for many students, the only reading will be what they do in the classroom. There is no incentive for them to read on their own and consequently, they have problems reading, i.e. it is hard/slow process for them to read.
2- I have not found the broad selection of quality comic or illustrated books/magazines in the likes of Journal de Tintin (defunct), Journal de Mickey, Spirou, and all the hard cover illustrated books that included an entire story from these magazines (Adventures of Blake and Mortimer and Tintin stories come to mind).
3- Finally, the American family is going through a transition with half my students from single parent families. This, along with the stresses involved makes it difficult for the child to have a stable, mind stimulating environment. The TV (especially since "bad" TV, talk shows, confrontations, etc... replaced the children hours 1600~1800) has replaced the baby sitter or the parent at home.
I hope it helps,
Lancelot
Actually, I would like to disagree with that. Maybe it's just the area you're in. I don't collect comic books much, but I buy the collections and treasuries. Not because of the price and availability, but because of the durability. Hardbound and "soft cover" treasuries and collections just last longer for me and finding the actual older comic books would be very difficult. And with a 5 year old and 9 year old + their friends reading them, I need the durability factor. If they asked me to order a subscription, I would. But my first personal choice to be bought is any collection that I haven't bought yet.
As to kids not getting out from in front of the brain drain machine, I live in a pretty bad area. Over half the kids in my town are disadvantaged and many of them stay at my home more then they do at their house since there is no one there for them. But out of the 25-30 kids in the area under the age of 12, a sizable fraction of my older Disney collection (10-15 books) are constantly borrowed to read on their own time with more kids waiting for the books to be returned so they can borrow them. The newer collections (1995-present) don't seem to get borrowed so much, but the older Disney collections always out enough that I've been planning on finding and buying second books to stay in my library. And it's not only Disney comic collections that are asked for. The Richard Halliburton collections, Tom Swift Jr, and older Hardy Boys and Nancy Drews, as well as many others are being borrowed as well. Some kids may have never been introduced to good reading, I have to agree. But there seems (at least in my area) a lack of things kids will read that they enjoy. After reading the above when it came into my email, I asked one of the kids why he came to my place to borrow books (2 Hardy Boys and Carl Barks 1978 Mickey Mouse collection) and he told me that the books I had were more enjoyable then the ones in the library........ With an answer like that, I'll keep lending them out as much as they want me to. If the books becomes too worn or damaged to give out, I'll replace them if I can find them.
G.E. Craig
BTW, while I'm here in my second post to the newsletter..... Is there a good site that list older collections? Right now, my collecting process is very shoddy. If I see a collection and I recognize that I don't own it, I try to buy it if it's for sale ($230 for a unopened/perfect Carl Barks Donald Duck (1978?).... Yikes!!!! But I bought it for a non-lendable book), but I know there are gaps in what I have and what has been issued.
Shad Daly
A review of Hero Squad
Message 21 -
2010-04-20 at 16:21:52
Just ran across this:
http://www.worldfamouscomics.com/tony/back20100415.shtml
--
Shad Z. ^Q^
My Blog: http://www.livejournal.com/~shadzane/
My Web Site: http://shadz.homestead.com/files/
http://www.worldfamouscomics.com/tony/back20100415.shtml
--
Shad Z. ^Q^
My Blog: http://www.livejournal.com/~shadzane/
My Web Site: http://shadz.homestead.com/files/
Familien Enget
[SPG,Suspected,pattern=3.60]Don't people read anymore?
Message 22 -
2010-04-20 at 17:04:16
Dani?l wonders why kids read so little when the several thousand pages of Harry Potter rates so high on book sales and popularity. Well, I've read them all myself, and I am 40 years old. First of all, they hit kids in all ages perfectly. I bet there are more kids in all ages watching the films rather than reading the books, though. The huge numbers of pages is one cause. Another cause is, I think, that reading is a downpointing activity. My son starts 1st grade come August, and we've been told at parents meeting now to read 15 minutes per day in order to help the development of his reading abilities. Unless parents have taught their kids to read books, they are less likely to sit down with any book, Harry Potter or not! Being brought up on good books and Donald Duck weekly, I certainly hope my kids will love reading...
Erlend, Norway
Erlend, Norway
Dave Rawson
Disney Sales
Message 23 -
2010-04-20 at 19:42:18
I'm wondering if it might have anything to do with whether or not parents
read aloud to their young children?
On Sun, Apr 18, 2010 at 5:08 AM, <UNDBKB at aol.com> wrote:
> Familien Enget writes:
> How come Disney comics sell so bad in the US compared to the good numbers
> in Europe, among them Norway?
>
> I guess as a Norwegian American I would have to say Norwegians are
> "Smarter" than the average American!
>
> Barry Branvold
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> http://nafsk.se/mailman/listinfo/dcml
>
read aloud to their young children?
On Sun, Apr 18, 2010 at 5:08 AM, <UNDBKB at aol.com> wrote:
> Familien Enget writes:
> How come Disney comics sell so bad in the US compared to the good numbers
> in Europe, among them Norway?
>
> I guess as a Norwegian American I would have to say Norwegians are
> "Smarter" than the average American!
>
> Barry Branvold
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> http://nafsk.se/mailman/listinfo/dcml
>
Søren Krarup Olesen
Don't people read anymore?
Message 24 -
2010-04-20 at 19:56:13
Dear Dani?l,
On 2010-04-19 12:31, D.M. van Eijmeren wrote:
> Question about the discussion on bad sales of Disney comics in the USA:
> If people don't read anymore, why are Joanne Rowling's very thick books
> about Harry Potter so popular amongst today's children? The thickness of
> those books even scares me away, an old man of 36 years. :-P
> The total Potter-story must be over thousands of pages long. And the kids
> love to read it! How come?
The answer is simple: Because they, the stories, describe a fantasy
universe into which kids (optionally older childish people like you and
myself) can project themselves and thus forget about the trivial dayly
life for a moment.
That concept or whatever we choose to call it is very different from our
classy Mickey and Donald plus e.g. Tintin, Asterix and many more. These
are more like observing a story from distance. Obviously most of the
situations and scenes can be considered similar to daily life and most
readers have their own favourite and can associate with the specific
character, but only to a certain remote degree.
Harry Potter (just to follow your example) may even *attract* people,
girls mostly but also boys who might like to get e.g. similar glasses to
look intellectual or whatever. I doubt Donald ever "attracted" people
and readers in the same manner.
All the above are simple guesses. I have no idea on how it really works.
Just a few thoughts... :-)
S?ren
On 2010-04-19 12:31, D.M. van Eijmeren wrote:
> Question about the discussion on bad sales of Disney comics in the USA:
> If people don't read anymore, why are Joanne Rowling's very thick books
> about Harry Potter so popular amongst today's children? The thickness of
> those books even scares me away, an old man of 36 years. :-P
> The total Potter-story must be over thousands of pages long. And the kids
> love to read it! How come?
The answer is simple: Because they, the stories, describe a fantasy
universe into which kids (optionally older childish people like you and
myself) can project themselves and thus forget about the trivial dayly
life for a moment.
That concept or whatever we choose to call it is very different from our
classy Mickey and Donald plus e.g. Tintin, Asterix and many more. These
are more like observing a story from distance. Obviously most of the
situations and scenes can be considered similar to daily life and most
readers have their own favourite and can associate with the specific
character, but only to a certain remote degree.
Harry Potter (just to follow your example) may even *attract* people,
girls mostly but also boys who might like to get e.g. similar glasses to
look intellectual or whatever. I doubt Donald ever "attracted" people
and readers in the same manner.
All the above are simple guesses. I have no idea on how it really works.
Just a few thoughts... :-)
S?ren
Santiago García
Mr. Erlend's message about Disney comics sales inthe US...
Message 25 -
2010-04-22 at 14:42:36
G.E. Craig:
>>I asked one of the kids why he came to my place to borrow books (2 Hardy Boys and Carl Barks 1978 Mickey Mouse collection) and he told me that the books I had were more enjoyable then the ones in the library........ With an answer like that, I'll keep lending them out as much as they want me to. If the books becomes too worn or damaged to give out, I'll replace them if I can find them.
God bless you, my friend. Me, I failed trying to get my nephews keen on reading comics. Even reading in general... :-(
Santiago.
>>I asked one of the kids why he came to my place to borrow books (2 Hardy Boys and Carl Barks 1978 Mickey Mouse collection) and he told me that the books I had were more enjoyable then the ones in the library........ With an answer like that, I'll keep lending them out as much as they want me to. If the books becomes too worn or damaged to give out, I'll replace them if I can find them.
God bless you, my friend. Me, I failed trying to get my nephews keen on reading comics. Even reading in general... :-(
Santiago.
Familien Enget
Disney Sales
Message 26 -
2010-04-22 at 16:08:45
Dave Rawson; Reading aloud to kids is vital to develop the reading skills! My kids love being read for, but it's not easy to read three different books to three different kids (age 10, 6 and 3) each night. Many parents sind here, but it's better being read for a few times a week, than never... The message from the management at the our elementary school last week for parents to the new firstgraders is: READ AT LEAST 15 MINUTES EACH DAY TO YOUR KIDS! I don't think this however will increase, at least not automatically, the sales rates of any Disney comic book...
Erlend
Erlend
Guy Lapointe
DCML Digest, Vol 86, Issue 13
Message 27 -
2010-04-22 at 20:11:56
Hi G.E.
Thank you for your comments.
I am not complaining about America per se. I have a second career as a teacher, hockey/soccer coach and counselor. I have fought with the local three network stations to put some children-friendly shows on tv during the 0400~0600 pm time slot. I work mostly with abandonned and/or impoverished children in the North Eastern states. I just made some observation as I was looking 30 years back.
Believe me, I am all for Disney, old Hanna Barbera, Warner Brother comics - I have pushed for the Scholastic Books, I manned the town library after church to "catch" kids that could be brought by their parents.
This is a trend I have noticed. I have to deal with children that are (to my knowledge) much more "damaged" than what I saw 30 years ago. I am not blaming the kids, I am blaming marketing, commercialism (legal ads on TV during children hour), etc...
I am glad that in your part of the country things are as you describe them. Up here, either I am getting too old or we are loosing ground. I also have to defend (or protect) children for many problems I rarely dealt with in the past, at least at that age (rape, pregnancy, incest, drugs +++, alcohol...) I am talking about kids here, not adolescents. It hurts, I see their pain having to face issues that would challenge an adult. One network removed "Bugs Bunny" because it was too violent for children - now, they can enjoy "Judge Alex" instead, much better...
Sincerely, L
From: dcml-request at nafsk.se
Subject: DCML Digest, Vol 86, Issue 13
To: dcml at nafsk.se
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2010 12:13:12 +0200
Send DCML mailing list submissions to
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--Forwarded Message Attachment--
From: pacrat100 at hotmail.com
To: dcml at nafsk.se
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2010 06:40:46 -0500
Subject: [SPG, Suspected, pattern=3.60]RE: Mr. Erlend's message about Disney comics sales inthe US...
I am not Mr. Leach but I am American and have lived in Europe several
years (France, Italy, and Spain).
This is what I have noticed.
1- The average American youth does not read much on their own, TV, video
games, computer (games mostly) and Internet surfing has displaced books as a
past time. As a teacher, for many students, the only reading will be what
they do in the classroom. There is no incentive for them to read on their
own and consequently, they have problems reading, i.e. it is hard/slow
process for them to read.
2- I have not found the broad selection of
quality comic or illustrated books/magazines in the likes of Journal de
Tintin (defunct), Journal de Mickey, Spirou, and all the hard cover illustrated
books that included an entire story from these magazines (Adventures of Blake
and Mortimer and Tintin stories come to mind).
3- Finally, the American
family is going through a transition with half my students from single parent
families. This, along with the stresses involved makes it difficult for the
child to have a stable, mind stimulating environment. The TV (especially
since "bad" TV, talk shows, confrontations, etc... replaced the children
hours 1600~1800) has replaced the baby sitter or the parent at home.
I hope
it helps,
Lancelot
Actually, I would like to disagree with that.
Maybe it's just the area you're in. I don't collect comic books
much, but I buy the collections and treasuries. Not because of the
price and availability, but because of the durability. Hardbound and "soft
cover" treasuries and collections just last longer for me and finding the actual
older comic books would be very difficult. And with a 5 year old and
9 year old + their friends reading them, I need the durability factor. If
they asked me to order a subscription, I would. But my first personal
choice to be bought is any collection that I haven't bought yet.
As to kids not getting out from in front of the
brain drain machine, I live in a pretty bad area. Over half the
kids in my town are disadvantaged and many of them stay at my home
more then they do at their house since there is no one there for them. But
out of the 25-30 kids in the area under the age of 12, a sizable fraction of my
older Disney collection (10-15 books) are constantly borrowed to read on their
own time with more kids waiting for the books to be returned so they can borrow
them. The newer collections (1995-present) don't seem to get borrowed
so much, but the older Disney collections always out enough that I've been
planning on finding and buying second books to stay in my
library. And it's not only Disney comic collections that are asked
for. The Richard Halliburton collections, Tom Swift Jr, and older Hardy
Boys and Nancy Drews, as well as many others are being borrowed as
well. Some kids may have never been introduced to good reading, I have to
agree. But there seems (at least in my area) a lack of things kids will
read that they enjoy. After reading the above when it came into my email,
I asked one of the kids why he came to my place to borrow books (2 Hardy
Boys and Carl Barks 1978 Mickey Mouse collection) and he told me that the books
I had were more enjoyable then the ones in the library........ With an
answer like that, I'll keep lending them out as much as they want me to.
If the books becomes too worn or damaged to give out, I'll replace them if I can
find them.
G.E. Craig
BTW, while I'm here in my second post to the
newsletter..... Is there a good site that list older collections?
Right now, my collecting process is very shoddy. If I see a collection and
I recognize that I don't own it, I try to buy it if it's for sale ($230 for a
unopened/perfect Carl Barks Donald Duck (1978?).... Yikes!!!! But I bought
it for a non-lendable book), but I know there are gaps in what I have and what
has been issued.
--Forwarded Message Attachment--
From: shadslists at gmail.com
To: dcml at nafsk.se
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2010 07:21:52 -0600
Subject: A review of Hero Squad
Just ran across this:
http://www.worldfamouscomics.com/tony/back20100415.shtml
--
Shad Z. ^Q^
My Blog: http://www.livejournal.com/~shadzane/
My Web Site: http://shadz.homestead.com/files/
--Forwarded Message Attachment--
From: abeenget at online.no
To: dve at kabelfoon.nl; dcml at nafsk.se
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2010 16:04:16 +0200
Subject: [SPG,Suspected,pattern=3.60]Re: Don't people read anymore?
Dani?l wonders why kids read so little when the several
thousand pages of Harry Potter rates so high on book sales and popularity. Well,
I've read them all myself, and I am 40 years old. First of all, they hit kids in
all ages perfectly. I bet there are more kids in all ages watching the films
rather than reading the books, though. The huge numbers of pages is one cause.
Another cause is, I think, that reading is a downpointing activity. My son
starts 1st grade come August, and we've been told at parents meeting now to
read 15 minutes per day in order to help the development of his reading
abilities. Unless parents have taught their kids to read books, they are less
likely to sit down with any book, Harry Potter or not! Being brought up on good
books and Donald Duck weekly, I certainly hope my kids will love
reading...
Erlend, Norway
--Forwarded Message Attachment--
From: TheGuy at DRawson.Com
To: dcml at nafsk.se
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2010 09:42:18 -0700
Subject: Re: Disney Sales
I'm wondering if it might have anything to do with whether or not parents read aloud to their young children?
On Sun, Apr 18, 2010 at 5:08 AM, <UNDBKB at aol.com> wrote:
Familien Enget writes:
How come Disney comics sell so bad in the US compared to the good
numbers in Europe, among them Norway?
I guess as a Norwegian American I would have to say Norwegians are
"Smarter" than the average American!
Barry Branvold
_______________________________________________
http://nafsk.se/mailman/listinfo/dcml
Thank you for your comments.
I am not complaining about America per se. I have a second career as a teacher, hockey/soccer coach and counselor. I have fought with the local three network stations to put some children-friendly shows on tv during the 0400~0600 pm time slot. I work mostly with abandonned and/or impoverished children in the North Eastern states. I just made some observation as I was looking 30 years back.
Believe me, I am all for Disney, old Hanna Barbera, Warner Brother comics - I have pushed for the Scholastic Books, I manned the town library after church to "catch" kids that could be brought by their parents.
This is a trend I have noticed. I have to deal with children that are (to my knowledge) much more "damaged" than what I saw 30 years ago. I am not blaming the kids, I am blaming marketing, commercialism (legal ads on TV during children hour), etc...
I am glad that in your part of the country things are as you describe them. Up here, either I am getting too old or we are loosing ground. I also have to defend (or protect) children for many problems I rarely dealt with in the past, at least at that age (rape, pregnancy, incest, drugs +++, alcohol...) I am talking about kids here, not adolescents. It hurts, I see their pain having to face issues that would challenge an adult. One network removed "Bugs Bunny" because it was too violent for children - now, they can enjoy "Judge Alex" instead, much better...
Sincerely, L
From: dcml-request at nafsk.se
Subject: DCML Digest, Vol 86, Issue 13
To: dcml at nafsk.se
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2010 12:13:12 +0200
Send DCML mailing list submissions to
dcml at nafsk.se
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
http://nafsk.se/mailman/listinfo/dcml
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of DCML digest..."
--Forwarded Message Attachment--
From: pacrat100 at hotmail.com
To: dcml at nafsk.se
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2010 06:40:46 -0500
Subject: [SPG, Suspected, pattern=3.60]RE: Mr. Erlend's message about Disney comics sales inthe US...
I am not Mr. Leach but I am American and have lived in Europe several
years (France, Italy, and Spain).
This is what I have noticed.
1- The average American youth does not read much on their own, TV, video
games, computer (games mostly) and Internet surfing has displaced books as a
past time. As a teacher, for many students, the only reading will be what
they do in the classroom. There is no incentive for them to read on their
own and consequently, they have problems reading, i.e. it is hard/slow
process for them to read.
2- I have not found the broad selection of
quality comic or illustrated books/magazines in the likes of Journal de
Tintin (defunct), Journal de Mickey, Spirou, and all the hard cover illustrated
books that included an entire story from these magazines (Adventures of Blake
and Mortimer and Tintin stories come to mind).
3- Finally, the American
family is going through a transition with half my students from single parent
families. This, along with the stresses involved makes it difficult for the
child to have a stable, mind stimulating environment. The TV (especially
since "bad" TV, talk shows, confrontations, etc... replaced the children
hours 1600~1800) has replaced the baby sitter or the parent at home.
I hope
it helps,
Lancelot
Actually, I would like to disagree with that.
Maybe it's just the area you're in. I don't collect comic books
much, but I buy the collections and treasuries. Not because of the
price and availability, but because of the durability. Hardbound and "soft
cover" treasuries and collections just last longer for me and finding the actual
older comic books would be very difficult. And with a 5 year old and
9 year old + their friends reading them, I need the durability factor. If
they asked me to order a subscription, I would. But my first personal
choice to be bought is any collection that I haven't bought yet.
As to kids not getting out from in front of the
brain drain machine, I live in a pretty bad area. Over half the
kids in my town are disadvantaged and many of them stay at my home
more then they do at their house since there is no one there for them. But
out of the 25-30 kids in the area under the age of 12, a sizable fraction of my
older Disney collection (10-15 books) are constantly borrowed to read on their
own time with more kids waiting for the books to be returned so they can borrow
them. The newer collections (1995-present) don't seem to get borrowed
so much, but the older Disney collections always out enough that I've been
planning on finding and buying second books to stay in my
library. And it's not only Disney comic collections that are asked
for. The Richard Halliburton collections, Tom Swift Jr, and older Hardy
Boys and Nancy Drews, as well as many others are being borrowed as
well. Some kids may have never been introduced to good reading, I have to
agree. But there seems (at least in my area) a lack of things kids will
read that they enjoy. After reading the above when it came into my email,
I asked one of the kids why he came to my place to borrow books (2 Hardy
Boys and Carl Barks 1978 Mickey Mouse collection) and he told me that the books
I had were more enjoyable then the ones in the library........ With an
answer like that, I'll keep lending them out as much as they want me to.
If the books becomes too worn or damaged to give out, I'll replace them if I can
find them.
G.E. Craig
BTW, while I'm here in my second post to the
newsletter..... Is there a good site that list older collections?
Right now, my collecting process is very shoddy. If I see a collection and
I recognize that I don't own it, I try to buy it if it's for sale ($230 for a
unopened/perfect Carl Barks Donald Duck (1978?).... Yikes!!!! But I bought
it for a non-lendable book), but I know there are gaps in what I have and what
has been issued.
--Forwarded Message Attachment--
From: shadslists at gmail.com
To: dcml at nafsk.se
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2010 07:21:52 -0600
Subject: A review of Hero Squad
Just ran across this:
http://www.worldfamouscomics.com/tony/back20100415.shtml
--
Shad Z. ^Q^
My Blog: http://www.livejournal.com/~shadzane/
My Web Site: http://shadz.homestead.com/files/
--Forwarded Message Attachment--
From: abeenget at online.no
To: dve at kabelfoon.nl; dcml at nafsk.se
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2010 16:04:16 +0200
Subject: [SPG,Suspected,pattern=3.60]Re: Don't people read anymore?
Dani?l wonders why kids read so little when the several
thousand pages of Harry Potter rates so high on book sales and popularity. Well,
I've read them all myself, and I am 40 years old. First of all, they hit kids in
all ages perfectly. I bet there are more kids in all ages watching the films
rather than reading the books, though. The huge numbers of pages is one cause.
Another cause is, I think, that reading is a downpointing activity. My son
starts 1st grade come August, and we've been told at parents meeting now to
read 15 minutes per day in order to help the development of his reading
abilities. Unless parents have taught their kids to read books, they are less
likely to sit down with any book, Harry Potter or not! Being brought up on good
books and Donald Duck weekly, I certainly hope my kids will love
reading...
Erlend, Norway
--Forwarded Message Attachment--
From: TheGuy at DRawson.Com
To: dcml at nafsk.se
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2010 09:42:18 -0700
Subject: Re: Disney Sales
I'm wondering if it might have anything to do with whether or not parents read aloud to their young children?
On Sun, Apr 18, 2010 at 5:08 AM, <UNDBKB at aol.com> wrote:
Familien Enget writes:
How come Disney comics sell so bad in the US compared to the good
numbers in Europe, among them Norway?
I guess as a Norwegian American I would have to say Norwegians are
"Smarter" than the average American!
Barry Branvold
_______________________________________________
http://nafsk.se/mailman/listinfo/dcml
Cord Wiljes
[SPG,Suspected,pattern=3.60]AW: Disney Sales
Message 28 -
2010-04-23 at 15:17:09
I remember a study in which Chinese native speakers read Chinese Texts to
very young (<1y) children. Later in life the children were able to speak
Chinese sounds which were not part of their own language, even though they
never learned Chinese. When the same experiment was repeated with records
instead of human readers no effect was found. So the human interaction
(emotion!) seems to be absolutely essential for motivation and learning even
(or especially) at this young age.
I have repeatedly heard from adults who had never read comic books in their
own childhood that they had serious problems reading comics now because they
did not know where to start or how to preceed. They had not learned the
"language" of comics at an early age.
I believe comics are very good source of reading material for children
because they have pictures which is very important, the feature recognizable
characters, and they have the appeal of "not just for kids" which marks most
great childrens' books. I have read Donald Duck and Asterix to the children
of friends and they liked it very much. And once the children start learning
to read you can alternate: The adult reads the first panel and the child the
second one.
I also noticed how much children, even at the youngest age, recognize and
appreciate quality. Not only do they instinctively prefer Barks' stories
over others' but they even know which Barks stories they like best. They are
very good critics.
Cord
very young (<1y) children. Later in life the children were able to speak
Chinese sounds which were not part of their own language, even though they
never learned Chinese. When the same experiment was repeated with records
instead of human readers no effect was found. So the human interaction
(emotion!) seems to be absolutely essential for motivation and learning even
(or especially) at this young age.
I have repeatedly heard from adults who had never read comic books in their
own childhood that they had serious problems reading comics now because they
did not know where to start or how to preceed. They had not learned the
"language" of comics at an early age.
I believe comics are very good source of reading material for children
because they have pictures which is very important, the feature recognizable
characters, and they have the appeal of "not just for kids" which marks most
great childrens' books. I have read Donald Duck and Asterix to the children
of friends and they liked it very much. And once the children start learning
to read you can alternate: The adult reads the first panel and the child the
second one.
I also noticed how much children, even at the youngest age, recognize and
appreciate quality. Not only do they instinctively prefer Barks' stories
over others' but they even know which Barks stories they like best. They are
very good critics.
Cord
Guy Lapointe
[SPG, Suspected,
Message 29 -
2010-04-24 at 17:46:42
Good point Cord!
Your comments remind me that while in college in the late sixties (Canada), in a psychology class project, we looked the cartoon preference of about 60 3rd graders. We used an amateur projector and 8mm clips of Huckleberry Hound (HB), Tom & Jerry (HB-MGM), Rocky & Bullwinkle, Captain Crunch (Jay Ward Prods), Road Runner (I think, stylized version, WB) and 2 European cartoons I cannot remember. We could only get 50 or 100-foot clips of these shows and could not find any Disney loops. Our college arts department rated the cartoons by the complexity of the drawings, life-like images like background, continuity of action; basically, a good reflection of the cost/work invested in creating the clip. I believe these clips were abstracts from genuine TV or Theater cartoons. Working with what was available to us, we tried to match the clips that included a chase or fight (Tom & Jerry?s conflicts come to mind here) ? that was the sixties?
Strangely enough, both kids and the department made the same selection, in decreasing order of preference:
Tom & Jerry, Huckleberry Round, Road Runner, European cartoon 1, Rocky, Captain Crunch commercial, European cartoon 2.
These were all cartoons characters that children were familiar with, had been shown one way or another in the previous year on TV (not the same episode but same characters) and that all the children could identify by name. Our study group was made exclusively of boys (boys and girls were segregated in schools at that time). We concluded that children (male 3rd graders) could and did notice a quality in the making of a cartoon which correlated directly with their preference of better made cartoons/drawings. Understand that this was a college student project and not a professionally designed double-bind study. It does fit in with your comments - thank you.
Guy
--Forwarded Message Attachment--
From: cord at wiljes.de
CC: notebook at wiljes.de
To: abeenget at online.no; TheGuy at drawson.com; dcml at nafsk.se
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2010 14:17:09 +0200
Subject: [SPG,Suspected,pattern=3.60]AW: Disney Sales
I remember a study in which Chinese native speakers read Chinese Texts to very young (<1y) children. Later in life the children were able to speak Chinese sounds which were not part of their own language, even though they never learned Chinese. When the same experiment was repeated with records instead of human readers no effect was found. So the human interaction (emotion!) seems to be absolutely essential for motivation and learning even (or especially) at this young age.
I have repeatedly heard from adults who had never read comic books in their own childhood that they had serious problems reading comics now because they did not know where to start or how to preceed. They had not learned the "language" of comics at an early age.
I believe comics are very good source of reading material for children because they have pictures which is very important, the feature recognizable characters, and they have the appeal of "not just for kids" which marks most great childrens' books. I have read Donald Duck and Asterix to the children of friends and they liked it very much. And once the children start learning to read you can alternate: The adult reads the first panel and the child the second one.
I also noticed how much children, even at the youngest age, recognize and appreciate quality. Not only do they instinctively prefer Barks' stories over others' but they even know which Barks stories they like best. They are very good critics.
Cord
Your comments remind me that while in college in the late sixties (Canada), in a psychology class project, we looked the cartoon preference of about 60 3rd graders. We used an amateur projector and 8mm clips of Huckleberry Hound (HB), Tom & Jerry (HB-MGM), Rocky & Bullwinkle, Captain Crunch (Jay Ward Prods), Road Runner (I think, stylized version, WB) and 2 European cartoons I cannot remember. We could only get 50 or 100-foot clips of these shows and could not find any Disney loops. Our college arts department rated the cartoons by the complexity of the drawings, life-like images like background, continuity of action; basically, a good reflection of the cost/work invested in creating the clip. I believe these clips were abstracts from genuine TV or Theater cartoons. Working with what was available to us, we tried to match the clips that included a chase or fight (Tom & Jerry?s conflicts come to mind here) ? that was the sixties?
Strangely enough, both kids and the department made the same selection, in decreasing order of preference:
Tom & Jerry, Huckleberry Round, Road Runner, European cartoon 1, Rocky, Captain Crunch commercial, European cartoon 2.
These were all cartoons characters that children were familiar with, had been shown one way or another in the previous year on TV (not the same episode but same characters) and that all the children could identify by name. Our study group was made exclusively of boys (boys and girls were segregated in schools at that time). We concluded that children (male 3rd graders) could and did notice a quality in the making of a cartoon which correlated directly with their preference of better made cartoons/drawings. Understand that this was a college student project and not a professionally designed double-bind study. It does fit in with your comments - thank you.
Guy
--Forwarded Message Attachment--
From: cord at wiljes.de
CC: notebook at wiljes.de
To: abeenget at online.no; TheGuy at drawson.com; dcml at nafsk.se
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2010 14:17:09 +0200
Subject: [SPG,Suspected,pattern=3.60]AW: Disney Sales
I remember a study in which Chinese native speakers read Chinese Texts to very young (<1y) children. Later in life the children were able to speak Chinese sounds which were not part of their own language, even though they never learned Chinese. When the same experiment was repeated with records instead of human readers no effect was found. So the human interaction (emotion!) seems to be absolutely essential for motivation and learning even (or especially) at this young age.
I have repeatedly heard from adults who had never read comic books in their own childhood that they had serious problems reading comics now because they did not know where to start or how to preceed. They had not learned the "language" of comics at an early age.
I believe comics are very good source of reading material for children because they have pictures which is very important, the feature recognizable characters, and they have the appeal of "not just for kids" which marks most great childrens' books. I have read Donald Duck and Asterix to the children of friends and they liked it very much. And once the children start learning to read you can alternate: The adult reads the first panel and the child the second one.
I also noticed how much children, even at the youngest age, recognize and appreciate quality. Not only do they instinctively prefer Barks' stories over others' but they even know which Barks stories they like best. They are very good critics.
Cord
Professor T W Wong
The decline of comics?
Message 30 -
2010-04-25 at 09:44:05
Dear all
I have been following the discussions and comments on possible
reasons for the decline of the popularity of comics. The change in
the media, TV, the internet .... perhaps changes in the social
environment and education system, might have played a part. I would
just wish to share my own experience with the Walt Disney comics when
I was young (a Hong Kong boy).
We had one publisher of Disney comics back then in the early 1960s.
They were published once a month, were directly translated into
Chinese, and smaller in size than the regular US copies. Early
stories I still remember well include Christmas in Schakletown and
other classical stories. Later, in the mid-60s, a bilingual version
was published. I especially liked the idea as it allowed me, a nature
Chinese speaker, to learn more English, especially the spoken version
not taught in class. Stories like the magic carpet (where Magica de
Spell turned into a giant Roc), the paper chase in "North of Yukon",
a story about big wigs, the "Horse Radish" are mong the best stories
I've read. The subscriptions (quite expensive at that time) were
shared by my siblings, and I shared the stories with kids younger
than myself, earning my reputation as a master story-teller.
Even though the comic company ceased publishing Disney comics in Hong
Kong, I still follow the comics when I grew up - US versions from
various foreign magazine shops (which were very expensive), and
whenever I travelled. (But they were hard to get even in the US
magazine shops, back in the early '80s.)
My child grew up with Disnel comics, still maintained in good
conditions. And I feel that the stories had a good influence on
children. There is always a 'moral' of the story, and the good guys prevail!
It is a pity that Disney DUCK (my favorite) comics are on the
decline. I am sure the world would be a better place, and our adults
in future would be better persons if they all read and love these comics.
A $crooge fan.
At 18:13 24/4/2010, you wrote:
>Send DCML mailing list submissions to
> dcml at nafsk.se
>
>To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://nafsk.se/mailman/listinfo/dcml
>or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> dcml-request at nafsk.se
>
>You can reach the person managing the list at
> dcml-owner at nafsk.se
>
>When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>than "Re: Contents of DCML digest..."
>
>
>From: "Cord Wiljes" <cord at wiljes.de>
>Precedence: list
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>Cc: notebook at wiljes.de
>To: "'Familien Enget'" <abeenget at online.no>,
> "'Dave Rawson'" <TheGuy at drawson.com>, <dcml at nafsk.se>
>References:
><2e283.d9ef2b1.38fc504e at aol.com><i2pa63c145a1004200942s9a9e86e8i2fee965ab30568c0 at mail.gmail.com>
> <F46692B233B347A69B9D0174B6770C44 at FamilienEnget>
>In-Reply-To: <F46692B233B347A69B9D0174B6770C44 at FamilienEnget>
>Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2010 14:17:09 +0200
>Message-ID: <63004C1EAEEF45C78298CCCC1FFD6299 at IBM843215DC246>
>Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
> boundary="----=_NextPart_000_249D_01CAE2EF.A937FBC0"
>Subject: [SPG,Suspected,pattern=3.60]AW: Disney Sales
>Message: 1
>
>I remember a study in which Chinese native speakers read Chinese
>Texts to very young (<1y) children. Later in life the children were
>able to speak Chinese sounds which were not part of their own
>language, even though they never learned Chinese. When the same
>experiment was repeated with records instead of human readers no
>effect was found. So the human interaction (emotion!) seems to be
>absolutely essential for motivation and learning even (or
>especially) at this young age.
>
>I have repeatedly heard from adults who had never read comic books
>in their own childhood that they had serious problems reading comics
>now because they did not know where to start or how to preceed. They
>had not learned the "language" of comics at an early age.
>
>I believe comics are very good source of reading material for
>children because they have pictures which is very important, the
>feature recognizable characters, and they have the appeal of "not
>just for kids" which marks most great childrens' books. I have read
>Donald Duck and Asterix to the children of friends and they liked it
>very much. And once the children start learning to read you can
>alternate: The adult reads the first panel and the child the second one.
>
>I also noticed how much children, even at the youngest age,
>recognize and appreciate quality. Not only do they instinctively
>prefer Barks' stories over others' but they even know which Barks
>stories they like best. They are very good critics.
>
>Cord
I have been following the discussions and comments on possible
reasons for the decline of the popularity of comics. The change in
the media, TV, the internet .... perhaps changes in the social
environment and education system, might have played a part. I would
just wish to share my own experience with the Walt Disney comics when
I was young (a Hong Kong boy).
We had one publisher of Disney comics back then in the early 1960s.
They were published once a month, were directly translated into
Chinese, and smaller in size than the regular US copies. Early
stories I still remember well include Christmas in Schakletown and
other classical stories. Later, in the mid-60s, a bilingual version
was published. I especially liked the idea as it allowed me, a nature
Chinese speaker, to learn more English, especially the spoken version
not taught in class. Stories like the magic carpet (where Magica de
Spell turned into a giant Roc), the paper chase in "North of Yukon",
a story about big wigs, the "Horse Radish" are mong the best stories
I've read. The subscriptions (quite expensive at that time) were
shared by my siblings, and I shared the stories with kids younger
than myself, earning my reputation as a master story-teller.
Even though the comic company ceased publishing Disney comics in Hong
Kong, I still follow the comics when I grew up - US versions from
various foreign magazine shops (which were very expensive), and
whenever I travelled. (But they were hard to get even in the US
magazine shops, back in the early '80s.)
My child grew up with Disnel comics, still maintained in good
conditions. And I feel that the stories had a good influence on
children. There is always a 'moral' of the story, and the good guys prevail!
It is a pity that Disney DUCK (my favorite) comics are on the
decline. I am sure the world would be a better place, and our adults
in future would be better persons if they all read and love these comics.
A $crooge fan.
At 18:13 24/4/2010, you wrote:
>Send DCML mailing list submissions to
> dcml at nafsk.se
>
>To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://nafsk.se/mailman/listinfo/dcml
>or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> dcml-request at nafsk.se
>
>You can reach the person managing the list at
> dcml-owner at nafsk.se
>
>When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>than "Re: Contents of DCML digest..."
>
>
>From: "Cord Wiljes" <cord at wiljes.de>
>Precedence: list
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>Cc: notebook at wiljes.de
>To: "'Familien Enget'" <abeenget at online.no>,
> "'Dave Rawson'" <TheGuy at drawson.com>, <dcml at nafsk.se>
>References:
><2e283.d9ef2b1.38fc504e at aol.com><i2pa63c145a1004200942s9a9e86e8i2fee965ab30568c0 at mail.gmail.com>
> <F46692B233B347A69B9D0174B6770C44 at FamilienEnget>
>In-Reply-To: <F46692B233B347A69B9D0174B6770C44 at FamilienEnget>
>Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2010 14:17:09 +0200
>Message-ID: <63004C1EAEEF45C78298CCCC1FFD6299 at IBM843215DC246>
>Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
> boundary="----=_NextPart_000_249D_01CAE2EF.A937FBC0"
>Subject: [SPG,Suspected,pattern=3.60]AW: Disney Sales
>Message: 1
>
>I remember a study in which Chinese native speakers read Chinese
>Texts to very young (<1y) children. Later in life the children were
>able to speak Chinese sounds which were not part of their own
>language, even though they never learned Chinese. When the same
>experiment was repeated with records instead of human readers no
>effect was found. So the human interaction (emotion!) seems to be
>absolutely essential for motivation and learning even (or
>especially) at this young age.
>
>I have repeatedly heard from adults who had never read comic books
>in their own childhood that they had serious problems reading comics
>now because they did not know where to start or how to preceed. They
>had not learned the "language" of comics at an early age.
>
>I believe comics are very good source of reading material for
>children because they have pictures which is very important, the
>feature recognizable characters, and they have the appeal of "not
>just for kids" which marks most great childrens' books. I have read
>Donald Duck and Asterix to the children of friends and they liked it
>very much. And once the children start learning to read you can
>alternate: The adult reads the first panel and the child the second one.
>
>I also noticed how much children, even at the youngest age,
>recognize and appreciate quality. Not only do they instinctively
>prefer Barks' stories over others' but they even know which Barks
>stories they like best. They are very good critics.
>
>Cord
Pages:
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