Author
Topic: Close call...
(43 messages)
Debbie
Close call...
Message 16 -
2012-07-26 at 15:13:52
I think part of the problem with being a fan of anything is that you automatically have higher expectations for something you really enjoy. Barks, Gottfredson and Rosa's work (and others, like Jippes, Scarpa and Van Horn) all set the bar fairly high. Not every writer or artist can reach that standard. Does that make these others work bad? No. But the big names set the standard, and are more likely to be the books that will be returned to and talked about more often, while I'm sure that copies of, let's say, BOOM's Uncle Scrooge/Ducktales comics have been mostly read once or twice and then filed away in some dusty archive or given away to neighborhood kids. I don't think it's snobbery that keeps Gottfredson, Barks and Rosa at the top of fans "must read" lists, its that most often these are the books that made casual readers into fans.
Roger North
Close call...
Message 17 -
2012-07-26 at 23:14:48
I agree with you Debbie.
Synthetic Hermit
Close call...
Message 18 -
2012-07-27 at 03:43:32
You're not a snob if you prefer a certain artist, but still like others. I'm talking about the people who think Barks is pretty much the only person who has ever made good stories, and all the others are utter hacks.
As a Rosa fan (not a snob - I like many others, Van Horn & Barks in particular), I have a special disdain for those who think Rosa is too mechanical both in art & writing, and gets all of his good ideas from Barks. In reality, Rosa has plenty of originality (admittedly, his best stories are inspired by historical events, but Barks has done that as well), puts a TON of unnecessary but fantastic details into his art, and everything he's taken from Barks has simply been a tip-of-the-hat to his favorite not-himself Duck artist. 8-)
EDIT: I sure hope that site comes back online...
As a Rosa fan (not a snob - I like many others, Van Horn & Barks in particular), I have a special disdain for those who think Rosa is too mechanical both in art & writing, and gets all of his good ideas from Barks. In reality, Rosa has plenty of originality (admittedly, his best stories are inspired by historical events, but Barks has done that as well), puts a TON of unnecessary but fantastic details into his art, and everything he's taken from Barks has simply been a tip-of-the-hat to his favorite not-himself Duck artist. 8-)
EDIT: I sure hope that site comes back online...
Robb_K
Close call...
Message 19 -
2012-07-27 at 04:59:32
Quote from user: ArnaudQuote from user: Synthetic HermitDown with Barks snobs!!!
What about Don Rosa snobs ? (I'm not one of them. :D )
I'M definitely not one of them. I don't like his finished drawing in the slightest (although I found his scribbles nice!). I like the writing of a few of his stories (mostly those driven by gags or a single comedic idea, rather than history. Funny, because I am an historian, and I like to learn the history of The Ducks, but not in a heavy-history-and fact-run "story". I enjoy it best in the Barks, Scarpa, Kruse, Geradts, Gulbransson, Milton, Falberg, Gottfredson style, in which the "episode" that's occurring before one's eyes in the comic story is driving it, and the "history" and facts learned is a distant, secondary extra bonus to the story, and doesn't clutter it up.
I'm not really a Disney Comics fan. I couldn't even look at the Strobl stories published from 1959-the 1970s, nor those of Kay Wright, or most of those drawing in the mid '60s on. I hated Al Hubbard's Duck stories. I couldn't even read them because of the art. I hated the comics artwork (and, especially Duck stories of many of the ex-Disney Animation artists (most of the Duck artists from the '40s and beginning of the '50s who were NOT Carl Barks. I disliked the Ducks of Murry (but liked his Bre'r Rabbit, Pancho. I HATED Dick Moores' Ducks, but like his Mouse artwork. I am a "drawing Snob". If the artwork is not to my liking, I CAN'T even read a story. If the artwork is nice, even if the story is TERRIBLE, and makes no sense, I will like the story (to some extent).
It was the same with my taste in other funny animal comics. I like only certain artists, and dislike the rest such that I wouldn't even bother reading the stories.
In addition to Barks, I like Jippes, Milton, Verhagen, Gulbransson, Branca, early Vicar, Scarpa, early Rota, Early Mau Heymans, Gottfredson, Bill Wright, Manny Gonzales, early Murry.
But, I'd say I'm a Barks and Gottfredson snob, as I place the next favourite artists (Jippes, Branca, Milton, Scarpa) quite farm behind those2, and place the next group VERY far from those 2, and place the so-so artists ridiculously far from those 2, and place all the others NOT EVEN ON THE MAP. AND, I consider both the only authorities on The Ducks and Mice (Universes). If anyone else introduced something that negates anything those 2 placed in their stories (EVEN IF THEY CONFLICT with their own usage in others of their OWN stories, I refuse to accept the "new" artist/writer's "facts".
What about Don Rosa snobs ? (I'm not one of them. :D )
I'M definitely not one of them. I don't like his finished drawing in the slightest (although I found his scribbles nice!). I like the writing of a few of his stories (mostly those driven by gags or a single comedic idea, rather than history. Funny, because I am an historian, and I like to learn the history of The Ducks, but not in a heavy-history-and fact-run "story". I enjoy it best in the Barks, Scarpa, Kruse, Geradts, Gulbransson, Milton, Falberg, Gottfredson style, in which the "episode" that's occurring before one's eyes in the comic story is driving it, and the "history" and facts learned is a distant, secondary extra bonus to the story, and doesn't clutter it up.
I'm not really a Disney Comics fan. I couldn't even look at the Strobl stories published from 1959-the 1970s, nor those of Kay Wright, or most of those drawing in the mid '60s on. I hated Al Hubbard's Duck stories. I couldn't even read them because of the art. I hated the comics artwork (and, especially Duck stories of many of the ex-Disney Animation artists (most of the Duck artists from the '40s and beginning of the '50s who were NOT Carl Barks. I disliked the Ducks of Murry (but liked his Bre'r Rabbit, Pancho. I HATED Dick Moores' Ducks, but like his Mouse artwork. I am a "drawing Snob". If the artwork is not to my liking, I CAN'T even read a story. If the artwork is nice, even if the story is TERRIBLE, and makes no sense, I will like the story (to some extent).
It was the same with my taste in other funny animal comics. I like only certain artists, and dislike the rest such that I wouldn't even bother reading the stories.
In addition to Barks, I like Jippes, Milton, Verhagen, Gulbransson, Branca, early Vicar, Scarpa, early Rota, Early Mau Heymans, Gottfredson, Bill Wright, Manny Gonzales, early Murry.
But, I'd say I'm a Barks and Gottfredson snob, as I place the next favourite artists (Jippes, Branca, Milton, Scarpa) quite farm behind those2, and place the next group VERY far from those 2, and place the so-so artists ridiculously far from those 2, and place all the others NOT EVEN ON THE MAP. AND, I consider both the only authorities on The Ducks and Mice (Universes). If anyone else introduced something that negates anything those 2 placed in their stories (EVEN IF THEY CONFLICT with their own usage in others of their OWN stories, I refuse to accept the "new" artist/writer's "facts".
Kimba_1962
Close call...
Message 20 -
2012-07-27 at 20:28:11
No snob, I. In addition to Barks himself, I also enjoy:
Rosa and Van Horn
The better (important qualifier) Strobl and Murry stories
Gottfredson
A goodly number of Egmont, Dutch, and Italian-produced stories (esp. Branca, Ferioli, Jippes, Verhagen, Scarpa, Cavazzano)
Al Hubbard's SCAMP
Bob Langhans' stories for the Disney Comics DUCKTALES title
The DUCKTALES TV series itself
GK/Whitman's WINNIE THE POOH title
... and I probably missed a few!
Rosa and Van Horn
The better (important qualifier) Strobl and Murry stories
Gottfredson
A goodly number of Egmont, Dutch, and Italian-produced stories (esp. Branca, Ferioli, Jippes, Verhagen, Scarpa, Cavazzano)
Al Hubbard's SCAMP
Bob Langhans' stories for the Disney Comics DUCKTALES title
The DUCKTALES TV series itself
GK/Whitman's WINNIE THE POOH title
... and I probably missed a few!
Synthetic Hermit
Close call...
Message 21 -
2012-07-28 at 01:33:32
Quote from user: Robb_KBut, I'd say I'm a Barks and Gottfredson snob
Yes, yes you are.
The way you go on about artists "periods" and the way they draw/write specific characters...it's just so pompous!
All Duck artists have something to bring to the fold, no matter their specific style. Don Rosa brings technical mastery:
http://i.imgur.com/Pj50g.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/C7dJa.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Y7YQM.jpg
And yes, his use of history does often get in the way of traditional storytelling, but the way he spins all of those facts into feature-length adventures is an amazing talent.
Yes, yes you are.
The way you go on about artists "periods" and the way they draw/write specific characters...it's just so pompous!
All Duck artists have something to bring to the fold, no matter their specific style. Don Rosa brings technical mastery:
http://i.imgur.com/Pj50g.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/C7dJa.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Y7YQM.jpg
And yes, his use of history does often get in the way of traditional storytelling, but the way he spins all of those facts into feature-length adventures is an amazing talent.
Robb_K
Close call...
Message 22 -
2012-07-28 at 04:11:20
Quote from user: Synthetic HermitQuote from user: Robb_KBut, I'd say I'm a Barks and Gottfredson snob
Yes, yes you are.
The way you go on about artists "periods" and the way they draw/write specific characters...it's just so pompous!
All Duck artists have something to bring to the fold, no matter their specific style. Don Rosa brings technical mastery:
And yes, his use of history does often get in the way of traditional storytelling, but the way he spins all of those facts into feature-length adventures is an amazing talent.
Pompous! I don't mean to imply that some artists work is worthy and that of others are worthless. I'm a creator, myself. I wouldn't want a lot of Disney comics fans thinking that MY work is worthless. I can only give my own opinion as to my personal tastes. Just because I don't like Dick Moores', Romano Scarpa's, Paul Murry's, Riley Thompson's, Bob Moore's, Al Hubbard's and other artists Duck drawing doesn't mean that I don't appreciate the high quality of their art. It's just not how I want to see The Ducks drawn (and, perhaps, even the trees and ocean, lake and river water). I grew up liking Barks and Gottfredson's work (style) MUCH, MUCH more than all the others. So, naturally, I like the styles nearer to theirs (like the Ducks of Jippes, Milton, Gulbransson, Verhagen, and the Mice of Gonzales, Wright, Scarpa). I like the late '30s to mid '50s writing style of stories. I guess I don't identify much with the modern World. I'm stuck in the past-sort of like the owner of "Yesterday Ranch". But, I don't mean to say that my personal taste should be followed by everyone, and the artists and writers whose style I don't like (for The Ducks, Mice or whatever, is poor quality.
Clearly, you are more of a Disney Comics (and comic book) fan than I. As you would probably read ANY Disney Comic story, and give it a "chance"-to see if you might like it. So, maybe I'm rather a "personal art style taste" fan, rather than a comic book fan. Maybe I have written too much on this forum, and I'm giving a poor impression of myself that will come back to haunt me. I surely hope not. I wouldn't want people to think I'm pompous. But, I can see why people might think that, given that I stated that I can't even read a story if the artwork isn't to my taste, But I also said that about the colouring used by Gold Key. I only read The Baks Gold Keys once each, and didn't really even digest the stories.
Yes, yes you are.
The way you go on about artists "periods" and the way they draw/write specific characters...it's just so pompous!
All Duck artists have something to bring to the fold, no matter their specific style. Don Rosa brings technical mastery:
And yes, his use of history does often get in the way of traditional storytelling, but the way he spins all of those facts into feature-length adventures is an amazing talent.
Pompous! I don't mean to imply that some artists work is worthy and that of others are worthless. I'm a creator, myself. I wouldn't want a lot of Disney comics fans thinking that MY work is worthless. I can only give my own opinion as to my personal tastes. Just because I don't like Dick Moores', Romano Scarpa's, Paul Murry's, Riley Thompson's, Bob Moore's, Al Hubbard's and other artists Duck drawing doesn't mean that I don't appreciate the high quality of their art. It's just not how I want to see The Ducks drawn (and, perhaps, even the trees and ocean, lake and river water). I grew up liking Barks and Gottfredson's work (style) MUCH, MUCH more than all the others. So, naturally, I like the styles nearer to theirs (like the Ducks of Jippes, Milton, Gulbransson, Verhagen, and the Mice of Gonzales, Wright, Scarpa). I like the late '30s to mid '50s writing style of stories. I guess I don't identify much with the modern World. I'm stuck in the past-sort of like the owner of "Yesterday Ranch". But, I don't mean to say that my personal taste should be followed by everyone, and the artists and writers whose style I don't like (for The Ducks, Mice or whatever, is poor quality.
Clearly, you are more of a Disney Comics (and comic book) fan than I. As you would probably read ANY Disney Comic story, and give it a "chance"-to see if you might like it. So, maybe I'm rather a "personal art style taste" fan, rather than a comic book fan. Maybe I have written too much on this forum, and I'm giving a poor impression of myself that will come back to haunt me. I surely hope not. I wouldn't want people to think I'm pompous. But, I can see why people might think that, given that I stated that I can't even read a story if the artwork isn't to my taste, But I also said that about the colouring used by Gold Key. I only read The Baks Gold Keys once each, and didn't really even digest the stories.
Hedberg
Close call...
Message 23 -
2012-07-28 at 06:06:34
I shook hands with Don and told him I liked his work, his enormous care for details and his, sometimes, very askew view on humor.
Does that make me a Rosa-snob?
I like the Barks ducks better.
Does that make me a Barks-snob?
I even told Don how much I appreciate Barks - and he told me, he did too.
Does that make Rosa a Barks-snob?
No, and I don't want to see this stupid Barks/Rosa-war starting up once again - not here (or anywhere else for that matter)
This is about funny-papers, not rocket-science or high risk economics....
But now I'll just say welcome to you, Synthetic Hermit - and don't let this come between constructive discussions!
Does that make me a Rosa-snob?
I like the Barks ducks better.
Does that make me a Barks-snob?
I even told Don how much I appreciate Barks - and he told me, he did too.
Does that make Rosa a Barks-snob?
No, and I don't want to see this stupid Barks/Rosa-war starting up once again - not here (or anywhere else for that matter)
This is about funny-papers, not rocket-science or high risk economics....
But now I'll just say welcome to you, Synthetic Hermit - and don't let this come between constructive discussions!
Dutch Duckfan Down Under
Close call...
Message 24 -
2012-07-28 at 17:37:31
Am I the only one who likes Don Rosa's drawings? Many people (including himself) say that he's a really bad artist, but this drawing style is my favorite in all of Duck comics. It's the style I try to draw in myself (Duck heads especially, other things not so much), but I'm too influenced by others to exactly match it. I don't like it that much when his Ducks are overreacting, or in the 1980s and 2000s.
Debbie
Close call...
Message 25 -
2012-07-28 at 18:25:18
I like Don Rosa's artwork. He is a very good artist. I even have a few collections of his work, and would gladly purchase a Don Rosa Library much like the Carl Barks series Fantagraphics is doing if they were to release one. I may look at them with a critical eye, but I even look at Barks and Gottfredson that way as well. All three have done some fantastic work and some real clunkers as well.
A bit off-topic, but the artist that I really miss and wish someone would collect his work is William Van Horn. I liked his Donald Duck stories, and especially the ones he did for Gladstone's DuckTales comic books. They made an otherwise mostly skippable Gladstone title worth reading.
A bit off-topic, but the artist that I really miss and wish someone would collect his work is William Van Horn. I liked his Donald Duck stories, and especially the ones he did for Gladstone's DuckTales comic books. They made an otherwise mostly skippable Gladstone title worth reading.
Robb_K
Close call...
Message 26 -
2012-07-28 at 19:46:23
Quote from user: DebbieI like Don Rosa's artwork. He is a very good artist. I even have a few collections of his work, and would gladly purchase a Don Rosa Library much like the Carl Barks series Fantagraphics is doing if they were to release one. I may look at them with a critical eye, but I even look at Barks and Gottfredson that way as well. All three have done some fantastic work and some real clunkers as well.
A bit off-topic, but the artist that I really miss and wish someone would collect his work is William Van Horn. I liked his Donald Duck stories, and especially the ones he did for Gladstone's DuckTales comic books. They made an otherwise mostly skippable Gladstone title worth reading.
I like Van Horn's storywriting. He's great with comedy. Very, very funny. Lots of unexpected, zany things happen. To me, he's sort of the "Jonathan Winters" of Duck storywriters. I didn't like his drawing style much, at first. The style looked much more like "Nervous Rex" than The Duck World. But, his drawing is now much more to my liking.
A bit off-topic, but the artist that I really miss and wish someone would collect his work is William Van Horn. I liked his Donald Duck stories, and especially the ones he did for Gladstone's DuckTales comic books. They made an otherwise mostly skippable Gladstone title worth reading.
I like Van Horn's storywriting. He's great with comedy. Very, very funny. Lots of unexpected, zany things happen. To me, he's sort of the "Jonathan Winters" of Duck storywriters. I didn't like his drawing style much, at first. The style looked much more like "Nervous Rex" than The Duck World. But, his drawing is now much more to my liking.
Synthetic Hermit
Close call...
Message 27 -
2012-07-28 at 23:00:32
I like Van Horn a lot. Very lightweight/cartoony drawings, and a fantastic sense of humour. :)
I also like Marco Rota, Romano Scarpa, Vic Lockman, and a bit of Daniel Branca.
I can't stand Mickey Mouse as a character, but otherwise Gottfredson's work is great.
I don't care much for the more recent artists. Or maybe the stories are just bad...
And you've redeemed yourself, Robb K. - what you said about me is accurate, and you've disproven your snobbery by showing that it's just a matter of taste in your case. 8-)
P.S. The #1 aspect of Disney Comics culture I can't stand is the overanalysis of Barks' work. They're just funny papers, people, NOT grand statements of our time!
I also like Marco Rota, Romano Scarpa, Vic Lockman, and a bit of Daniel Branca.
I can't stand Mickey Mouse as a character, but otherwise Gottfredson's work is great.
I don't care much for the more recent artists. Or maybe the stories are just bad...
And you've redeemed yourself, Robb K. - what you said about me is accurate, and you've disproven your snobbery by showing that it's just a matter of taste in your case. 8-)
P.S. The #1 aspect of Disney Comics culture I can't stand is the overanalysis of Barks' work. They're just funny papers, people, NOT grand statements of our time!
Robb_K
Close call...
Message 28 -
2012-07-28 at 23:31:56
Quote from user: Synthetic HermitAnd you've redeemed yourself, Robb K. - what you said about me is accurate, and you've disproven your snobbery by showing that it's just a matter of taste in your case. 8-)
Good! I'd hate to think a fellow Manitoban thought I was pompous! And a Winnipegger, no less. I used to live in North End, and in Garden City in West Kildonan. Where do you live?
Good! I'd hate to think a fellow Manitoban thought I was pompous! And a Winnipegger, no less. I used to live in North End, and in Garden City in West Kildonan. Where do you live?
Synthetic Hermit
Close call...
Message 29 -
2012-07-29 at 03:06:29
Just north of the city, near Birds Hill Park.
When I have some spare dough, I get my Scrooge comics at the Comic Factory on Notre Dame Ave. downtown (or, when I have even more dough to cover the shipping, the Bruce Hamilton website).
When I have some spare dough, I get my Scrooge comics at the Comic Factory on Notre Dame Ave. downtown (or, when I have even more dough to cover the shipping, the Bruce Hamilton website).
Robb_K
Close call...
Message 30 -
2012-07-29 at 06:56:07
Quote from user: Synthetic HermitJust north of the city, near Birds Hill Park.
When I have some spare dough, I get my Scrooge comics at the Comic Factory on Notre Dame Ave. downtown (or, when I have even more dough to cover the shipping, the Bruce Hamilton website).
Ha! Ha! When I lived there (back in the 1950s) there was no such thing as Comic Book Shops. We could find comics just about everywhere, grocery stores, drug stores and newsstands. But i know of one store in Winnipeg. Maxx Collectables (on Portage). A work colleague and artist partner of mine collected Disney newspaper comic strips from the 1940s, and he filled in much of his missing pages from them.
When I have some spare dough, I get my Scrooge comics at the Comic Factory on Notre Dame Ave. downtown (or, when I have even more dough to cover the shipping, the Bruce Hamilton website).
Ha! Ha! When I lived there (back in the 1950s) there was no such thing as Comic Book Shops. We could find comics just about everywhere, grocery stores, drug stores and newsstands. But i know of one store in Winnipeg. Maxx Collectables (on Portage). A work colleague and artist partner of mine collected Disney newspaper comic strips from the 1940s, and he filled in much of his missing pages from them.