Author
Topic: The current state of Disney Comics? Blame Ike?
(53 messages)
MustangRockstar
The current state of Disney Comics? Blame Ike?
Message 46 -
2012-07-22 at 07:38:47
I don't know if I am in the minority on this one, but I really didn't like the use of alternate covers. In other words, as a collector buying the same comic twice to get a different cover really didn't do it for me. I know I didn't HAVE to buy both covers, so I don't fault anyone. It just wasn't my thing.
Steet
The current state of Disney Comics? Blame Ike?
Message 47 -
2012-07-22 at 20:07:59
Mmm, sorry if my last message offended anyone, I'm just bitter and that's the result of years of disappointments over Disney's attitude.
Quote:Just to clarify the terms re: Disney characters:
Mickey, Donald, Scrooge etc. are called Standard Characters.
Snow White, Cinderella, Pocahontas etc. are called Classic Characters.
Yes, true. Got the two mixed up.
Quote:TaleSpin's absence from comics shelves has nothing to do with being neglected.
Darkwing Duck (to pick one example) is considered either a license on its own or part of the Standard Characters license (depending on contracts). In some areas of the world, this means that if a company want to publish Darkwing comics and already have the Standard Characters license, they can do so without problem. In other areas they'll have to buy the Darkwing Duck license.
TaleSpin is a different matter, though. The way I understand it, Disney consider TaleSpin part of the Jungle Book universe. This has the consequence that if a company want to publish a TaleSpin comic, they'll have to buy the entire Jungle Book license. (Or perhaps even the entire Classic Characters license; I'm not sure.) This means it is expensive to publish TaleSpin comics. Which makes it hard to make a profit on a TaleSpin book.
Yeah, I'm very well aware of this. And that's part of the reasons I'm bitter. Because it ALL relies on Disney.
Actually I didn't mean only comics. It seems like every time something happens related to the Disney Afternoon (which doesn't happen 1% enough), even the slightest little thing (eg : pin's, tee shirts...or even articles, "birthday" news, just about anything!), it seems the same shows are always being left aside, as if they never even existed (mostly TaleSpin and Gummi Bears, sometimes Gargoyles). I'd just like a little more recognition to these and to the Disney Afternoon in general (granted, the situation is improving in the recent years)
As for comics... Why consider TaleSpin like Jungle Book? Anyone who has watched the show would understand that only 3 characters are from the Jungle Book, and even if they share some physical and psychological similarities, they are clearly different characters. The creators of the show themselves said it was never considered a spin off of Jungle Book.
Why would Darkwing Duck be a part of the "Standard characters"? Because it's a duck? As far as I know, that's the only possible reason. Aside from Launchpad, the show has original characters that have never been used anywhere. I'm pretty sure that if Darkwing was, say, a cat, it would never have been included.
And if we go that way, shouldn't Scrooge/Ducktales require another licence too, considering they were featured in a theatrical movie like Jungle Book?
Why separating the shows like that? Wouldn't it be a lot more simple and logical to make a "Disney Afternoon" licence?
Anyway, the fact that Marvel is now doing comics in conjunction with Disney makes this irrelevant, at least when it comes to comics, because Disney owns their own licence...
And considering they wouldn't need any additional licence, and the sales of Boom! Disney comics, it would be foolish from them NOT to make more Disney Afternoon and "Standard characters" comics in the future. Or at least try to.
Quote:I have very grave doubts that anybody who's a fan of DA properties would dismiss the classic stuff as "kiddy books."
Maybe not directly, but many weren't simply interested. How do you explain that sales of the Disney Afternoon books were about twice that of the classics? I know they are reprints, compared to original creations, but still.
Quote:But why would they see DA shows from before they were born as any less "outdated/old fashioned?" Yes, I suppose Tailspin and Darkwing Duck are "brands," but it's not like The Kidz have a Pavlovian reaction to branding per se.
Because Disney Afternoon comics are "new" to them. They don't even have to know they are 20 years old series. I'm sure many bought them because they looked "cool".
Quote:I cannot help but note that you are extrapolating your own sensibilities outward with, as far as I can see, no justification.
Of course! I'm stating my opinion. Isn't that what everyone does on a forum? I'm not saying it's the absolute truth, just offering another position on what's wrong with Disney comics declining in the USA. (and the world)
Quote:Nonsense. Disney classics (the animated films) are always popular with kids, even when their grandparents watched the same films. It's really not as much of an issue as some people think. And they'll say it's 'kiddy stuff' before they care if it's old-fasioned. And it helps that most Disney comics hold up pretty well through the ages. Besides, Disney is a brand. It's Disney!
Disney classics films are still popular because they do massive advertising and have been doing so for years.
However, when it comes to animated series, Disney is probably the worst company when it comes to long-term support.
You know, I'm not making this up, but basing on friends and families around me, kids specifically. I tried to introduce some to the Donald/Scooge/Mickey comics myself, but they weren't very interested for the reasons I've stated. Not enough "cool". They DO kinda love the old video games with these characters, though.
Quote:I've been reading Disney classics for a decade now, and I've never grown tired of them. Just sayin'. If if weren't for that, I wouldn't be here.
Of course, but that's obviously not everyone's case, otherwise the sales wouldn't have fallen so much worldwide.
Quote:Just to clarify the terms re: Disney characters:
Mickey, Donald, Scrooge etc. are called Standard Characters.
Snow White, Cinderella, Pocahontas etc. are called Classic Characters.
Yes, true. Got the two mixed up.
Quote:TaleSpin's absence from comics shelves has nothing to do with being neglected.
Darkwing Duck (to pick one example) is considered either a license on its own or part of the Standard Characters license (depending on contracts). In some areas of the world, this means that if a company want to publish Darkwing comics and already have the Standard Characters license, they can do so without problem. In other areas they'll have to buy the Darkwing Duck license.
TaleSpin is a different matter, though. The way I understand it, Disney consider TaleSpin part of the Jungle Book universe. This has the consequence that if a company want to publish a TaleSpin comic, they'll have to buy the entire Jungle Book license. (Or perhaps even the entire Classic Characters license; I'm not sure.) This means it is expensive to publish TaleSpin comics. Which makes it hard to make a profit on a TaleSpin book.
Yeah, I'm very well aware of this. And that's part of the reasons I'm bitter. Because it ALL relies on Disney.
Actually I didn't mean only comics. It seems like every time something happens related to the Disney Afternoon (which doesn't happen 1% enough), even the slightest little thing (eg : pin's, tee shirts...or even articles, "birthday" news, just about anything!), it seems the same shows are always being left aside, as if they never even existed (mostly TaleSpin and Gummi Bears, sometimes Gargoyles). I'd just like a little more recognition to these and to the Disney Afternoon in general (granted, the situation is improving in the recent years)
As for comics... Why consider TaleSpin like Jungle Book? Anyone who has watched the show would understand that only 3 characters are from the Jungle Book, and even if they share some physical and psychological similarities, they are clearly different characters. The creators of the show themselves said it was never considered a spin off of Jungle Book.
Why would Darkwing Duck be a part of the "Standard characters"? Because it's a duck? As far as I know, that's the only possible reason. Aside from Launchpad, the show has original characters that have never been used anywhere. I'm pretty sure that if Darkwing was, say, a cat, it would never have been included.
And if we go that way, shouldn't Scrooge/Ducktales require another licence too, considering they were featured in a theatrical movie like Jungle Book?
Why separating the shows like that? Wouldn't it be a lot more simple and logical to make a "Disney Afternoon" licence?
Anyway, the fact that Marvel is now doing comics in conjunction with Disney makes this irrelevant, at least when it comes to comics, because Disney owns their own licence...
And considering they wouldn't need any additional licence, and the sales of Boom! Disney comics, it would be foolish from them NOT to make more Disney Afternoon and "Standard characters" comics in the future. Or at least try to.
Quote:I have very grave doubts that anybody who's a fan of DA properties would dismiss the classic stuff as "kiddy books."
Maybe not directly, but many weren't simply interested. How do you explain that sales of the Disney Afternoon books were about twice that of the classics? I know they are reprints, compared to original creations, but still.
Quote:But why would they see DA shows from before they were born as any less "outdated/old fashioned?" Yes, I suppose Tailspin and Darkwing Duck are "brands," but it's not like The Kidz have a Pavlovian reaction to branding per se.
Because Disney Afternoon comics are "new" to them. They don't even have to know they are 20 years old series. I'm sure many bought them because they looked "cool".
Quote:I cannot help but note that you are extrapolating your own sensibilities outward with, as far as I can see, no justification.
Of course! I'm stating my opinion. Isn't that what everyone does on a forum? I'm not saying it's the absolute truth, just offering another position on what's wrong with Disney comics declining in the USA. (and the world)
Quote:Nonsense. Disney classics (the animated films) are always popular with kids, even when their grandparents watched the same films. It's really not as much of an issue as some people think. And they'll say it's 'kiddy stuff' before they care if it's old-fasioned. And it helps that most Disney comics hold up pretty well through the ages. Besides, Disney is a brand. It's Disney!
Disney classics films are still popular because they do massive advertising and have been doing so for years.
However, when it comes to animated series, Disney is probably the worst company when it comes to long-term support.
You know, I'm not making this up, but basing on friends and families around me, kids specifically. I tried to introduce some to the Donald/Scooge/Mickey comics myself, but they weren't very interested for the reasons I've stated. Not enough "cool". They DO kinda love the old video games with these characters, though.
Quote:I've been reading Disney classics for a decade now, and I've never grown tired of them. Just sayin'. If if weren't for that, I wouldn't be here.
Of course, but that's obviously not everyone's case, otherwise the sales wouldn't have fallen so much worldwide.
GeoX
The current state of Disney Comics? Blame Ike?
Message 48 -
2012-07-23 at 06:52:19
Pfft--pardon the lack of proper formatting here; frankly, it's too much of a pain to try to properly nest quotes, especially at this hour.
Quote from user: steetBecause Disney Afternoon comics are "new" to them. They don't even have to know they are 20 years old series. I'm sure many bought them because they looked "cool".
Well? The classics would be just as "new" to them. Anything's new to kids. I know when I was small, I first read the old Barks stuff because it looked "cool."
Quote from user: steetI cannot help but note that you are extrapolating your own sensibilities outward with, as far as I can see, no justification.
Of course! I'm stating my opinion. Isn't that what everyone does on a forum? I'm not saying it's the absolute truth, just offering another position on what's wrong with Disney comics declining in the USA. (and the world)
It's one thing to state your opinion; it's another to say, sans evidence, that your opinion is indicative of larger trends. The favorable notices and high sales that the Fantagraphics Barks and Gottfredson volumes are enjoying would seem to be counterindications of the idea that people at large are just getting "bored" of the classics.
Quote from user: steetI've been reading Disney classics for a decade now, and I've never grown tired of them. Just sayin'. If if weren't for that, I wouldn't be here.
Of course, but that's obviously not everyone's case, otherwise the sales wouldn't have fallen so much worldwide.
Whoa whoa whoa--to say that whatever sales fluctuations may be taking place is the simple result of people "growing tired" of the classic characters is to assume facts that are simply not in evidence. Comic books in general sell less well than they used to, for all sorts of reasons having nothing to do with the characters per se.
It probably IS true that, in the short term, you would see slightly elevated sales for "new" comics that are seen as novelties. But this doesn't do anything to address whatever larger structural problems there are (which, admittedly, may be unaddressable). Also--not to sound too melodramatic about it--but if Disney comics can only survive by going the all-DA route (which I don't for a second believe), then let 'em die, for all I care. It is a matter of indifference to me.
Quote from user: steetBecause Disney Afternoon comics are "new" to them. They don't even have to know they are 20 years old series. I'm sure many bought them because they looked "cool".
Well? The classics would be just as "new" to them. Anything's new to kids. I know when I was small, I first read the old Barks stuff because it looked "cool."
Quote from user: steetI cannot help but note that you are extrapolating your own sensibilities outward with, as far as I can see, no justification.
Of course! I'm stating my opinion. Isn't that what everyone does on a forum? I'm not saying it's the absolute truth, just offering another position on what's wrong with Disney comics declining in the USA. (and the world)
It's one thing to state your opinion; it's another to say, sans evidence, that your opinion is indicative of larger trends. The favorable notices and high sales that the Fantagraphics Barks and Gottfredson volumes are enjoying would seem to be counterindications of the idea that people at large are just getting "bored" of the classics.
Quote from user: steetI've been reading Disney classics for a decade now, and I've never grown tired of them. Just sayin'. If if weren't for that, I wouldn't be here.
Of course, but that's obviously not everyone's case, otherwise the sales wouldn't have fallen so much worldwide.
Whoa whoa whoa--to say that whatever sales fluctuations may be taking place is the simple result of people "growing tired" of the classic characters is to assume facts that are simply not in evidence. Comic books in general sell less well than they used to, for all sorts of reasons having nothing to do with the characters per se.
It probably IS true that, in the short term, you would see slightly elevated sales for "new" comics that are seen as novelties. But this doesn't do anything to address whatever larger structural problems there are (which, admittedly, may be unaddressable). Also--not to sound too melodramatic about it--but if Disney comics can only survive by going the all-DA route (which I don't for a second believe), then let 'em die, for all I care. It is a matter of indifference to me.
Steet
The current state of Disney Comics? Blame Ike?
Message 49 -
2012-07-23 at 18:44:15
I've never said they should do only DA books! Just that they don't totally forget them.
There should be enough place in Marvel/Disney publications for all these kind of comics.
There should be enough place in Marvel/Disney publications for all these kind of comics.
GeoX
The current state of Disney Comics? Blame Ike?
Message 50 -
2012-07-23 at 23:38:17
That's fine; the DA stuff is clearly profitable, so it would make sense for them to keep it up. I just got the very strong sense from your posts that you were suggesting that classic material was on its way out, so publishers should prioritize it. That's what I don't agree with.
Matilda
The current state of Disney Comics? Blame Ike?
Message 51 -
2012-07-24 at 00:52:22
Dutch Duckfan Down Under: I have finally decided on my plan for an issue of WDCS. I am assuming direct publication under Disney auspices, and therefore the license to publish both standard and classic characters.
Cover: Nadorp's Madam Mim cover, where she's at a gas station for a fill-up for her broom HC DD 2010-50
Out of the Depths, Despair--a Dick Kinney/Al Hubbard Tabby/Donald/Fethry story; my favorite for Tabby's expressions and sardonic comments. S 64130 --7 pp
Flavor of the Month--a Sarah Kinney/Millet Lopez Madam Mim story, where Mim's appearance becomes (briefly) the "in" look, copied by everyone. D 2000-200 --5 pp
Heldenleven--a Geradts/Bas Heymans Donald/HDL story; the boys try to get their new dog to "save" Donald so he'll let them keep it--a very clever ending! H 26151 --4 pp
Vliegmuizen--a Geradts/Cardo Madam Mim one-pager; Mim whacks at mice with her broom, making it shed straws, and the mice fly on the straws. H 28039 --1 p
Fantome a tous les etages--a Rodolphe Jacquette Goofy/Mickey story, where they take on the ghost haunting Goofy's hotel. F JM 06222 --10 pp
The Day of the Knight--a Joel Katz Chip & Dale story I haven't read, but it's highly rated (for a short C&D story) on INDUCKS. D 7656 --5 pp
That's 32 pages of comics. If I can, I'd put a poster on the back cover; I like the "Hexaposter des Castors Juniors" of the map of the Junior Woodchucks' island, with all the kids (male and female) playing on it. I have a copy, but I bought it without its (French, obviously) comic book, just as a page removed from the book, and I can't find it on INDUCKS, so I can't give a reference for it!
Note the two stories originating in the Netherlands! :)
Cover: Nadorp's Madam Mim cover, where she's at a gas station for a fill-up for her broom HC DD 2010-50
Out of the Depths, Despair--a Dick Kinney/Al Hubbard Tabby/Donald/Fethry story; my favorite for Tabby's expressions and sardonic comments. S 64130 --7 pp
Flavor of the Month--a Sarah Kinney/Millet Lopez Madam Mim story, where Mim's appearance becomes (briefly) the "in" look, copied by everyone. D 2000-200 --5 pp
Heldenleven--a Geradts/Bas Heymans Donald/HDL story; the boys try to get their new dog to "save" Donald so he'll let them keep it--a very clever ending! H 26151 --4 pp
Vliegmuizen--a Geradts/Cardo Madam Mim one-pager; Mim whacks at mice with her broom, making it shed straws, and the mice fly on the straws. H 28039 --1 p
Fantome a tous les etages--a Rodolphe Jacquette Goofy/Mickey story, where they take on the ghost haunting Goofy's hotel. F JM 06222 --10 pp
The Day of the Knight--a Joel Katz Chip & Dale story I haven't read, but it's highly rated (for a short C&D story) on INDUCKS. D 7656 --5 pp
That's 32 pages of comics. If I can, I'd put a poster on the back cover; I like the "Hexaposter des Castors Juniors" of the map of the Junior Woodchucks' island, with all the kids (male and female) playing on it. I have a copy, but I bought it without its (French, obviously) comic book, just as a page removed from the book, and I can't find it on INDUCKS, so I can't give a reference for it!
Note the two stories originating in the Netherlands! :)
MrCleveland
The current state of Disney Comics? Blame Ike?
Message 52 -
2012-08-02 at 18:44:32
Quote from user: Roger NorthAutumn Mints you make a good point. Disney Comics aren't just for kids and they should not just be targeted towards long time fans. They should be for anyone who wants to read them. I hope the next company that publishes them finds away for the comic books to reach both targeted audiences. I was a child when I first started reading Disney comics. Back in the 80's they sold like hotcakes. This continued until the late 90's They stopped being popular mainly because they became difficult to get. If they had lower cover prices Maybe Newsstands wouldn't mind paying for them and both long time Disney Comics fans and newer fans would be able to buy them easier just like we used to back in the 80's and 90's but they would also have to have good quality story lines. The reasons why Gladstone and Gemstone were good was because a lot of the staff members grew up on Disney Comics. I hope the next company will be run by former Disney Comics fans who grew up on them like myself.
That is true...and there's a little humor in some comics that older people would LOL.
That is true...and there's a little humor in some comics that older people would LOL.
Roger North
The current state of Disney Comics? Blame Ike?
Message 53 -
2012-08-03 at 13:10:28
I'm glad you agree with me Mr Cleveland.