Keskustelujen arkisto

Just to add a couple more words to the subject at hand. Back on January 01, 2001,
I started a Disney Comics & Animation Message Board. The board is moderated by
me, but everyone is welcome to post. The message board is listed on the DCML, but
the postings to the board have dropped dramatically over the past couple years.
It still gets a number of hits related to the cartoon W.I.T.C.H., but mostly for
requests for the themesong. Otherwise it gets Spam from people selling their Male
Member Enlargements or Money Investment scams. I am automatically notified
everytime someone posts, so as soon as I can check the post I delete the spam. I
also try to ban the poster's IP address, but they seem to have so many the list of
banned IPs grows. I try to keep that in check as well. Posting is instantaneous
and threads about differing subjects are easily identified and followed.

Anyhow, I used to be much more excited about the MB, but after my previous Service
Provider dumped my entire HOOZOO website (including art), and I had to recreate it
(something I'm only lately getting time for since moving BACK to San Jose, CA),
and since interest in posting has dropped, my interest in doing EXTRA things (such
as creating new banners, highlighting special characters, updating links to
special sites, notifications about upcoming Animated features & DVD releases,
etc.) has likewise waned.

The most notable recent flurry of activity was when I posted a message about the
Religious Right attacking Disney as promoting Satanism for producing W.I.T.C.H.
Otherwise, it has reverted back to pre-teen girls requests for the WITCH themesong.

If there is a renewed interest in the Message Board, I'd be willing to resume a
concerted interest in making the board more colorful and interesting. I am the
sole moderator of the site (as loaned to me by Boardhost), but if anyone is
interested in CO-moderating it with me, and have ideas that they'd like to do with
it, I am open to that as well.

The board's address, for those not familiar with it, is:
http://members3.boardhost.com/DisneyComics/

Thanks,

Rich
(Email removed)

---- Msg sent via CWNet - http://www.cwnet.com/

Here is a little compilation of suggestions about the life of the two
European members of the Duck Family, Ludwig von Drake and Matilda McDuck, between
1930 and the early 1960's :

After the quarrel between Scrooge and his sisters in 1930, Hortense,
Quackmore, together with Donald, Della and Matilda, leave Duckburg for a city not very
far (as shown in Lo$). Soon after, Donald is left to Grandma's farm, where
he'll be raised by Grandma and Grandpa Duck, (as shown in Strobl's "The Good Old
Daze", the tv-show "This is your life, Donald Duck", and its comicbook
adaptation), as he was as unbearable as Huey, Dewey and Louie in their youth, and
the farm is a place where he'll work hard and calm down his temper. (There's
also the book "he Life of Donald Duck", in which we learn that Donald didn't know
he had a sister until Dumbella sent him the nephews... I don't consider it as
a serious source, but I'm keeping the idea of Donald and Della having a
separate childhood, and also liked the idea of Hortense, Quackmore and Della, the
three characters who have an uncertain future, staying together)...

Matilda, realising her sister, even though she doesn't have a perfect life,
succeeded and had a husband and two kids, while she's still an old maid,
(except maybe a brief date with Goostave Gander, a residual information from Barks'
1950's Duck Family Tree), decides to react and leaves for Vienna, where she'll
follow botanic studies...

There she meets Professor Ludwig von Drake, whom she marries short after (as
suggested by Don Rosa's unpublished sketches for his family tree, as well as
"The Little Big Book of Disney").
Only after she realizes that Ludwig has roots in Duckburg (In "Duckburg,
USA", it's told that Grandma's aunt married a Hofrat von Drake, from Vienna, which
I consider as Ludwig's grandpa... This is a contestable source, as it's only
in the German version, but in the original version of "The Family Tree Spree",
we're explicitly told that Ludwig and Donald have common ancestors. Also, the
presence of his cousin Frederico von Pato, which I translated Friedrich von
Drake, in two Brazilian stories about the History of Duckburg, proves that he
indeed has roots here), which makes an additionnal bond between them...

Matilda nevertheless comes to Duckburg from time to time, as in "A Letter
from Home", she seems to know Donald well, and not only by mail, and doesn't
hesitate in showing authority and spanking him when necessary! Maybe she even
stayed a bit longer after Grandpa Duck's death, around 1936, and helped Grandma
get through this, which would be another reason why she seems to have played a
part in Donald's education. (I've been asked : why the hell would she spend
some time at Grandma's while they're not directly related?! I'd say that once
you've tasted her cranberry pies, you definitely belong to the family forever!
Even Mickey Mouse calls her Grandma!). Ludwig was to busy to come to Duckburg
with her, and never met the family until 1961...

1939 : WW2! Ludwig and Matilda stay in Vienna, and Matilda will never get
back to Duckburg as she knows from the papers that Scrooge went back in business
and public life between 1947 and 1951, when he renovated the money bin...
Before 1947, he was recluse in his manor, but after this date, she's more likely
to meet him...

In 1948, as suggested in "The Old Castle's secret", Scottie McTerrier dies,
leaving McDuck Castle without a keeper... Donald secretly warns Matilda through
a letter... Matilda then decides to move back into the Castle, together with
Ludwig, who is often out for work. (Matilda couldn't find anybody else as
satisfied as Scottie to watch over the castle, and above all the Templars
treasure!). That might also be an occasion for them both to flee horrible memories of
the War. Scrooge knows nothing about her presence there...

In 1955, as shown in "A Letter From Home", 25 years after the quarrel,
Scrooge and Matilda are reunited again, Matilda forgives Scrooge, and both reconcile
with eachother. The Templars treasures is discovered... Ludwig wasn't met
here, probably on a lecture tour..

A few years later, Matilda moves back to Duckburg, willing to catch up with
wasted time.
She's followed by Ludwig in 1961, as shown in "Duckburg, USA", He doesn't
know Donald, Daisy, Grandma, Scrooge and the other Ducks yet. Matilda possibly
died a few years later. The McDuck castle remains without new keepers and is
whether vandalized as shown in Barks' "the hound of the whiskervilles", from
1960.

*

There's just one problem : "A little something special", in which the 50th
anniversary of Scrooge's arrival in Duckburg (1902 according to the Lo$) is
celebrated, must happen in 1952, and Ludwig can be briefly sen in it, together
with the other Duck Family members! I always thought this 1952 date was much too
early, while trying to class Barks/Rosa stories in chrono-logical order :
- In it, all the Barks stories with Magica and Flinty, the Rosa stories with
Goldie, seem to have already happened!
- Moreover, there's the machine made by Gyro, digging in Killmotor's hill,
which supposes the story happens after "Christmas for Schacktown+the few month
Scrooge lived with Donald+Gyro's 1st invention" : the killmotor Hill wouldn't
have resisted to this machine if it was still "empty", so the story happens
after the cavern has been re-filled.
- Duckburg seems to know Scrooge very well too, while I think he hasn't been
back in real active business life and back living in the renovated money bin
before 1951 (while the "annual corporate reconfiguration", "not my favorite
time of the year", suggests that Scrooge was back in business for several years).
- Then, the presence of frames with pictures of Fergus and Matilda on
Scrooge's walls would imply he already reconciliated with Matilda [?]
- There's also the autographed photograph of Mickey Mouse, which might mean
story might have happened a few years after 1955, the first year of the Mickey
Mouse Club tv show, whith which Mickey's carreer might have took a much more
popular, famous, and maybe philosophic turn (at least for Duckburg
inhabitants)

So this is really a problematic date, while I really don't think Don Rosa
could have found a better idea for using the "50th anniversary" thing... I'd say
it's rather the 50th anniversary of a date around 1912, at which McDuck's
money would have been used to finance a really big operation that was the real
beginning of Duckburg's development, which will later make it a "glorious city
economically fueled by McDuck investments"... Moreover this investment could
only have been lead by Scrooge's sisters as he wasn't seen in Duckburg before
1930 : that might be a reason why Scrooge in this story looks more irritated
than proud, as he won't admit that's an initiative of his sisters that provoked
his fame in Duckburg, and that this commeroration is the one of THEIR
success... This story would then happen in 1962...

Gilles R. Maurice

I, too, have a few reflections on this subject, which might be summed
up by the old saying "don't look a gift horse in the mouth!"...

By that I mean that as member of a mailing list (or other forum run on
a similar basis), one doesn't have very much in the way of rights one
way or another, and, in my opinion, particularly not the right to
demand that the forum is run in any particular way. What we enjoy here
is, in fact, something pretty close to that famous (and reputedly non-
existant) free lunch. We subscribe to the list *as it is* and of our
own free will; similarly we may at any time and of that same free will
leave the list. In my view the only rights one has regarding a mailing
list are a) not to be subscribed against one's will, and b) to be
unsubscribed when one so wishes.

For the rest, a mailing list belongs entirely to the list owner, who
is free to stop anyone from subscribing, who may at any time throw
whomever off the list, and in particular is free to run the list
according to his or her own preferences. A mailing list is not a
democracy, it is the private property of whomever owns it.

Of course, the list owner is also free to listen to the wishes and
suggestions of list members, to poll them on their views and opinions,
to be corteous and explain why certain decisions were made, etc. etc.
It might even be a good idea for the listowner to do so, as he/she
would otherwise risk ending up with a list but no members, but to what
extent is in my view entirely at the list owners discretion.

Anyway, if one is not happy about the way a list is run (or functions,
or whatever), and the list owner does not want to change it
accordingly, one does, in my opinion, have but three main options: to
take it on the chin and accept the situation as-is, to set up one's own
list/forum/resource/whatever, and/or to leave the list. In addition, if
the only problem that the list owner has with any proposed changes is
the time and resources needed to carry them out, one might also
volunteer to do the necessary work/spend the money needed/whatever
oneself.

I should perhaps add that my intention in writing the above is not to
tell anyone what they might or might not discuss on the list -- once
again that'd be a decision for the list owner, which I'm not. As far as
I'm concerned, we can discuss the list format until the cows not only
come home but are fed up with us and have gone out again. What I'm
trying to say is that in my opinion those who'd rather have the list in
a different format should feel perfectly free to suggest this to the
list owner, but should equally understand and accept that he/she/they
have the final say on what happens to the list.

A final comment: the question was asked how Per Starb?ck can know that
most current list members prefers receiving the daily digest... That, I
think, is simple enough: as list administrator he can easily find out
how many of us has made that choice when setting our preferences.

All the best,

/Mattias

*** Mattias Hallin ** Brussels ** Belgium ** <cmhallin at algonet.se> ***
* *
* "Oh bury me thar! With my battered git-tar! *
************* A-screamin' my heart out fer yew!" *************

Here's the INDUCKS data (I TL 430-B):

*Italy*

- Topolino Libretto
430<http://coa.inducks.org/issue.php/x/it/TL++430#g>(1964)
- Grandi Classici Disney
33<http://coa.inducks.org/issue.php/x/it/GCD++33#g>(1988)
- I Classici di Walt Disney seconda serie
274<http://coa.inducks.org/issue.php/x/it/CD++274#g>(1999)
- Grandi Classici Disney
203<http://coa.inducks.org/issue.php/x/it/GCD+203#g>(2003)

Of course, our version is unique in that it features some *beautiful* color
by Kneon Transitt (who's been INDUCKSed as Thom Pratt).

// Travis Seitler

On 4/12/06, Niels Houlberg Hansen <NHH at ra.sa.dk> wrote:
>
> Hello
>
> Is there anyone who knows where/when the Scarpa story "Foxy Hunters"
> (which
> is going to appear in Mickey Mouse Adventures #10) was first published?
>
> Thanks and kind regards,
> Niels

What I find amusing is that it seems as if we're having a long discussion
on a mailing list about whether or not it's even possible to *have* a long
discussion on a mailing list.

I use discussion forums online, and I use them a lot. But still I can't
imagine cutting out DCML in its current form -- because the DCML, as a
mailing list, is made for those people who actually don't have the time to
sit on a forum all day -- and that way, attending DCML *in addition to*
any Disney forum I use gives a whole new range of people to talk to all
around the world.

And sure, the delay from a message is sent until you recieve it can be
annoying, especially if you're used to forums. But wasn't this extra delay
added so that one could have the chance to moderate the list? Hey, this is
a mailing list, whenever anything is sent out, it appears in my personal
mailbox, and Per can't go in and delete obscenities in my personal mailbox
-- thus, it must be done before the message is sent. And unless we all
chip in on hiring people to do this job 24 hours a day, I don't see how
the necessity of moderating a mailing list can be done any other way than
delaying it.

And hey -- we're donaldists. The precursor of mailing lists were fanzines.
You got the donaldist magazine in your mailbox, you read the readers'
column, you were angered and upsed with something you read there, you
typed up a reply and sent it to the editor, and if you were lucky it was
on print three months later.

Sure. On the internet, it is possible to have real-time discussions.
That's one of the advantages of forums. Moderated mailing lists have other
advantages.

You can't choose between a mailing list and a forum. Or, you can, but they
aren't really comparable. A mailing list is one technology. A forum is
another. A chat is a third. A fanzine is a forth. They have certain things
in common, but they still are completely different.

Sure, real time discussions have been available on this list at a point.
Sure, if we ignore the advantages of disabling it, we can miss it. But
still, real time discussions are *not* the purpose of a mailing list, and
asking it from a mailing list is like asking that all story books should
come with a parent attached to read the stories out loud to you like when
we were kids.

A warm thank you to Per for maintaining the mailing list throughout the
years. It's been a pleasure reading it.

--
Olaf Solstrand

Norway's biggest Disney fan portal, with more than 1000 daily visits:
http://www.andebyonline.com

DAN:

> Anyone who wishes to converse about Disney comics in a Web forum is welcome
> to find one or start one.

Disney comics both old and new are often discussed at the Golden Age Funnies forum:
http://forums.goldenagecartoons.com/forumdisplay.php?f=5

DANI?L:

> But my past two messages of today still haven't turned up in the
> online DCML archives. How can one discuss and contribute this way?

They take their time in turning up because the moderators have to read them and approve them before they're released to the general public.

NEILS:

As Travis points out, the Pluto and Ellsworth story "Foxy Hunters" is I TL 430-B, but it's in fact only PART of I TL 430-B. The complete I TL 430-B is really a collection of several individual short, unrelated three- to five-page "chapters": one chapter co-starring Pluto (this is "Foxy Hunters"), one with Minnie, one with Goofy, etc.
Italian readers in the 1960s were used to Ellsworth stories being told in chapters like this, as previously the American Sunday pages had been presented in TOPOLINO the same way: i. e. several unrelated strips connected into a multi-chapter "story."
In the case of I TL 430-B, at Gemstone we have taken the liberty of separating the chapters, as they have no relation to each other, and we'll be presenting them as individual short stories in the coming months.

For a longer Scarpa Ellsworth story, readers can look to the upcoming Gemstone trade paperback, WALT DISNEY TREASURES - DISNEY COMICS: 75 YEARS OF INNOVATION, which will be coming out in July. It features the 18-page adventure "AKA Cormorant Number Twelve" (Gancio cormorano di fiducia).

David

P. S. (Yeah, we know it's a bit late to do our special book for the 75th. But production hit some unavoidable delays.)

>>>What I find amusing is that it seems as if we're having a long discussion

>>>on a mailing list about whether or not it's even possible to *have* a long

>>>discussion on a mailing list.

You got that right! :-)

>>>And hey -- we're donaldists. The precursor of mailing lists were fanzines.

I didn't know this! mea culpa! makes it even more precious!

>>>A warm thank you to Per for maintaining the mailing list throughout the
>>>years. It's been a pleasure reading it.

It goes without saying!!! Per should have his statue in Duckburg right next
to Ol' Cornelius!!!

Gilles