H.W.Fluks at kpn.com wrote:
> I think that's not unusual. The Dutch, for instance, had
> many "foreigners" in their army and fleet. One of them was
> an Englishman called Hudson, after whom the Hudson Bay and
> River were named.
Another one was Nils Olesen from Stavanger (where I live). You would know him as admiral Cornelius Cruys...
BUT, that was in the Netherlands. Was the situation the same on the other side of the channel?
Sigvald :-)
Author
Topic: 200210
(164 messages)
Sigvald
Some historical questions
Message 151 -
2002-10-29 at 20:39:32
Sigvald
Donna = Daisy (at least in HooZoo)
Message 152 -
2002-10-29 at 21:13:02
Hi all!
In Rich Bellacera's famous HooZoo pages can read about Daisy here:
http://users.cwnet.com/xephyr/rich/dzone/hoozoo/daisy.html
This page says this about Daisy:
KNOWN ALIASES: Donna Duck
Can you please enlighten us more about this Rick?
Sigvald :-)
In Rich Bellacera's famous HooZoo pages can read about Daisy here:
http://users.cwnet.com/xephyr/rich/dzone/hoozoo/daisy.html
This page says this about Daisy:
KNOWN ALIASES: Donna Duck
Can you please enlighten us more about this Rick?
Sigvald :-)
Sigvald
The value of unpublished material
Message 153 -
2002-10-29 at 21:23:11
Hi all!
I just read that unpublished Disney comics material should not be regarded as valuable as the published material as a reference for facts.
As an historian I disagree with that point of view. What matters is how a creator see something, not wether that view is published. As long as Barks did confirm that his unpublished tree is how he saw the relations between the Ducks, that are IMO facts as good as any other published Barksian facts.
Sigvald :-)
I just read that unpublished Disney comics material should not be regarded as valuable as the published material as a reference for facts.
As an historian I disagree with that point of view. What matters is how a creator see something, not wether that view is published. As long as Barks did confirm that his unpublished tree is how he saw the relations between the Ducks, that are IMO facts as good as any other published Barksian facts.
Sigvald :-)
DGE
RICH: Disney Family Trees
Message 154 -
2002-10-29 at 21:26:19
Hey Rich!
>There's also the case where, as originally presented, Mickey's
>own Nephews were apparently not even his relations at the beginning, but
>rather the children of a woman named Mrs. Fieldmouse, but as the story
>progressed, they adhered to the title "Nephews" and Mrs. Fieldmouse was
>lost to obscurity. In time we came to understand the boys' last name is
>still "Fieldmouse," but this is the name attributed to Mickey's "sister"
>(called "Amelia Fieldmouse" in Italy).
Actually, it happened *faster* than you suggest:
When Morty and Ferdie first appear in Sept. 1932, they talk about
"Unca Mickey", but Mickey calls their mom "Mrs. Fieldmouse", which- true,
isn't the way you'd think he'd address a relative. It was only a few *weeks*
later that the blood relationship was retroactively made clear, with Mickey
officially introducing Morty and Ferdie to Minnie as his nephews.
As for Mrs. Fieldmouse, she wasn't lost to obscurity. She returned
to pick the nephews up after their first visit to Mickey in 1932; a 1939
story mentioned her again; and at Egmont we frequently show her today. In
Egmont continuity, the kids live with her when they're not with Mickey. And
yes, in our continuity she is Mickey's sister. She has to be, if the kids
are to be real nephews.
The name Amalia (note spelling; I used to be wrong about this, too)
is actually her Dutch name, not her Italian one. In Egmont stories, she has
the English first name of Felicity.
As for Minnie's nieces,
>The truth is that there appears to be only ONE
>instance where [Minnie's nieces] are called Melody & Millicent,
>but their names changed to Pammy & Tammy
Actually, to the best of my knowledge, there's one story where
they're called Melody and Millicent, and one story where they're Pammy and
Tammy. The names didn't formally change from one to the other. More like two
stories were written, one without knowledge of the other.
>according
>to David Gerstein, only Egmont has decided on one set of "official" names;
>that being "Millie & Tillie."
Those names are actually the Danish names, which I discovered were
used verbatim on an old Egmont character list, and which were never used
anywhere in English. So they're no longer official. Since 1999, the official
reference names we use at Egmont are Millie and Melody.
The beauty of those names, BTW, is that they allow us to be
consistent all the time. When there are two, it's Millie and Melody, and
when the girl is singular, it's Melody.
Clarifyingly,
David
>There's also the case where, as originally presented, Mickey's
>own Nephews were apparently not even his relations at the beginning, but
>rather the children of a woman named Mrs. Fieldmouse, but as the story
>progressed, they adhered to the title "Nephews" and Mrs. Fieldmouse was
>lost to obscurity. In time we came to understand the boys' last name is
>still "Fieldmouse," but this is the name attributed to Mickey's "sister"
>(called "Amelia Fieldmouse" in Italy).
Actually, it happened *faster* than you suggest:
When Morty and Ferdie first appear in Sept. 1932, they talk about
"Unca Mickey", but Mickey calls their mom "Mrs. Fieldmouse", which- true,
isn't the way you'd think he'd address a relative. It was only a few *weeks*
later that the blood relationship was retroactively made clear, with Mickey
officially introducing Morty and Ferdie to Minnie as his nephews.
As for Mrs. Fieldmouse, she wasn't lost to obscurity. She returned
to pick the nephews up after their first visit to Mickey in 1932; a 1939
story mentioned her again; and at Egmont we frequently show her today. In
Egmont continuity, the kids live with her when they're not with Mickey. And
yes, in our continuity she is Mickey's sister. She has to be, if the kids
are to be real nephews.
The name Amalia (note spelling; I used to be wrong about this, too)
is actually her Dutch name, not her Italian one. In Egmont stories, she has
the English first name of Felicity.
As for Minnie's nieces,
>The truth is that there appears to be only ONE
>instance where [Minnie's nieces] are called Melody & Millicent,
>but their names changed to Pammy & Tammy
Actually, to the best of my knowledge, there's one story where
they're called Melody and Millicent, and one story where they're Pammy and
Tammy. The names didn't formally change from one to the other. More like two
stories were written, one without knowledge of the other.
>according
>to David Gerstein, only Egmont has decided on one set of "official" names;
>that being "Millie & Tillie."
Those names are actually the Danish names, which I discovered were
used verbatim on an old Egmont character list, and which were never used
anywhere in English. So they're no longer official. Since 1999, the official
reference names we use at Egmont are Millie and Melody.
The beauty of those names, BTW, is that they allow us to be
consistent all the time. When there are two, it's Millie and Melody, and
when the girl is singular, it's Melody.
Clarifyingly,
David
Goofy313g
Mickey's dad, a criminal (about unpublished material)
Message 155 -
2002-10-29 at 22:36:52
I think the idea of Mickey's father being a criminal is a good one, as
several of his ancestors have been (Tony Toponi, Rattinger,...). But maybe
this detail should stay hidden, and not used in a story... This would explain
why we never meet him, wereas we met Minnie's parents. Mickey probably
doesn't speak to him anymore...
About the unpublished material, i like to consider it as a fact, only when it
doesn't go against the final story (for instance, in Don Rosa's sketches,
Grandma is with Scrooge at the gold rush, and i don't consider this detail as
a fact, as in the final Lo$, he meets her in Duckburg, but there is nothing
against saying that Potcrack McDuck, an ancestor of scrooge from Don's
sketches, existed, so i consider he existed...). I think you can use
unpublished sketches and ideas to *complete* final stories. But if you
consider all disney stories ever published as one universe, you already
can't consider some facts as true facts (for instance, you'll have to make a
choice between considering that Scrooge is Grandma's brother or his son's
brother-in-law, in how many different stories do the heroes discover the
Horse of Troyes, for instance, or Atlantis? you'll have to chose one story
among dozens of stories... )You already hardly manage to tie all this stories
together, to find explanations, ... So including unpublised materials won't
be the best solution, of course...
So I only use to consider the *masters*'s unpublished ideas, when it's
possible...
Gilles
several of his ancestors have been (Tony Toponi, Rattinger,...). But maybe
this detail should stay hidden, and not used in a story... This would explain
why we never meet him, wereas we met Minnie's parents. Mickey probably
doesn't speak to him anymore...
About the unpublished material, i like to consider it as a fact, only when it
doesn't go against the final story (for instance, in Don Rosa's sketches,
Grandma is with Scrooge at the gold rush, and i don't consider this detail as
a fact, as in the final Lo$, he meets her in Duckburg, but there is nothing
against saying that Potcrack McDuck, an ancestor of scrooge from Don's
sketches, existed, so i consider he existed...). I think you can use
unpublished sketches and ideas to *complete* final stories. But if you
consider all disney stories ever published as one universe, you already
can't consider some facts as true facts (for instance, you'll have to make a
choice between considering that Scrooge is Grandma's brother or his son's
brother-in-law, in how many different stories do the heroes discover the
Horse of Troyes, for instance, or Atlantis? you'll have to chose one story
among dozens of stories... )You already hardly manage to tie all this stories
together, to find explanations, ... So including unpublised materials won't
be the best solution, of course...
So I only use to consider the *masters*'s unpublished ideas, when it's
possible...
Gilles
Xephyr
Of Ducks & Mice
Message 156 -
2002-10-29 at 22:41:03
Sigvald said:
>In Rich Bellacera's famous HooZoo pages can read about Daisy here:
> http://users.cwnet.com/xephyr/rich/dzone/hoozoo/daisy.html
>
> This page says this about Daisy:
> "KNOWN ALIASES: Donna Duck"
>
>Can you please enlighten us more about this Rick?
Sure. As of the discussion I started recently about "Donna & Mac"
the entries in the HOOZOO for Daisy AND Donald will certainly need
to be updated to reflect the new information we all learned.
It is being reworked to reflect that, still, Donna Duck is an
alias of Daisy's, and that, at least as far as the "animated" Daisy
Duck is concerned, she still evolved from the Donna Duck character
appearing in "Don Donald." The official Disney sources claim that
the "animated" Daisy Duck was originally called "Donna Duck", and
some sources even claim that the name "Donna" was a "role" that
Daisy played for the film. However, for "comics," Donna and Daisy
are two distinctly different characters. I will reference the
Taliaferro comics, and the actual first meeting between the American
Daisy and the Mexican Donna, and the brief role Donna played as
Donald's co-star in his early comics. However, her supposed role
as Daisy's genetic sister and the mother of April, May and June
is soley a matter of idle speculation among us Disney fans and,
until there is some Disney publication which at least furthers this
concept, I see no reason to account for or discount it in the HooZoo
at this time.
AND....
Not to contradict "The Maestro" :-) (David Gerstein) , since I do
respect what you say and have said in the past, but...
David Gerstein wrote:
> Actually, it happened *faster* than you suggest:
I agree with the timing. As I said, "as the story progressed..." I meant
indeed that the story itself revealed that they were indeed Mickey's
genetic nephews, but I was referring to the fact that, in the beginning (of
the story) there was no genetic connection inferred.
> As for Mrs. Fieldmouse, she wasn't lost to obscurity. She returned
to pick the nephews up after their first visit to Mickey in 1932;
I agree with this too... the "obscurity" comment was meant in the sense
that she doesn't reappear in any future stories (to my knowledge...), but
then you write....
> a 1939 story mentioned her again;
I didn't know that... thanks. :-)
> and at Egmont we frequently show her today.
> In Egmont continuity, the kids live with her when they're not with
> Mickey. And yes, in our continuity she is Mickey's sister. She has
> to be, if the kids are to be real nephews.
That makes perfect sense... just as Daisy's neices live with her sister,
their mother, when they are not visiting Daisy.
> The name Amalia (note spelling; I used to be wrong about this, too)
> is actually her Dutch name, not her Italian one. In Egmont stories,
> she has the English first name of Felicity.
So the name is "Felicity Fieldmouse" then, eh? Thanks. ;-) Has a "Mr.
Fieldmouse" ever appeared or any mention of his whereabouts?
As for Minnie's nieces,
> Actually, to the best of my knowledge, there's one story where
> they're called Melody and Millicent, and one story where they're
> Pammy and Tammy. The names didn't formally change from one to the
> other. More like two stories were written, one without knowledge
> of the other.
Both stories
"The Late, Late Show" October, 1962
http://stp.ling.uu.se/cgi-bin/starback/dcml/story?W+01518+A-06
"Mickey's Close Call" July, 1963
http://stp.ling.uu.se/cgi-bin/starback/dcml/story?W+MM+88-05
which I found while scouring my collection looking for possible
Twin nieces for Minnie several years ago, were drawn by Paul
Murry, who, at least artistically, insinuated that they were
the same nieces. The writer for both stories, who is unknown,
either did not know of the other story, or did not care.
Melody, by herself, was created by Jim Fletcher for the Studio
as I understand it, and was used much more frequently in comics
published for European and South American audiences. Fortunately,
I have many of those Melody stories, even though she is sadly
a very disliked character among the DCMLers. I just think she's
very misunderstood ;-).
About "Millie & Tillie."
> Those names are actually the Danish names, which I discovered
> were used verbatim on an old Egmont character list, and which
> were never used anywhere in English.
Interesting. Thanks.
> So they're no longer official. Since 1999, the official reference
> names we use at Egmont are Millie and Melody.
> The beauty of those names, BTW, is that they allow us to be
> consistent all the time. When there are two, it's Millie and
> Melody, and when the girl is singular, it's Melody.
Which was my own contention and speculation too, way back when we
were first discussing the relationships of the singular "Melody"
and the Twins "Melody & Millicent" on the DCML several years ago.
I'm glad to see that at least Egmont concurs. Did Egmont make
this change to model Dave Smith's "Archive" or was it decided
independently?
Thanks for clearing that all up, David.
Of course, this all began when I questioned the DCML, back in the
beginning of the List (1992???) about the reference to Minnie's
Niece as "Molly." I was glad to help see the change in at least
that one reference, and to learn so much about Minnie's relations.
Thanks,
Rich Bellacera
xephyr at cwnet.com
--------------------------------------------------------------------
mail2web - Check your email from the web at
http://mail2web.com/ .
>In Rich Bellacera's famous HooZoo pages can read about Daisy here:
> http://users.cwnet.com/xephyr/rich/dzone/hoozoo/daisy.html
>
> This page says this about Daisy:
> "KNOWN ALIASES: Donna Duck"
>
>Can you please enlighten us more about this Rick?
Sure. As of the discussion I started recently about "Donna & Mac"
the entries in the HOOZOO for Daisy AND Donald will certainly need
to be updated to reflect the new information we all learned.
It is being reworked to reflect that, still, Donna Duck is an
alias of Daisy's, and that, at least as far as the "animated" Daisy
Duck is concerned, she still evolved from the Donna Duck character
appearing in "Don Donald." The official Disney sources claim that
the "animated" Daisy Duck was originally called "Donna Duck", and
some sources even claim that the name "Donna" was a "role" that
Daisy played for the film. However, for "comics," Donna and Daisy
are two distinctly different characters. I will reference the
Taliaferro comics, and the actual first meeting between the American
Daisy and the Mexican Donna, and the brief role Donna played as
Donald's co-star in his early comics. However, her supposed role
as Daisy's genetic sister and the mother of April, May and June
is soley a matter of idle speculation among us Disney fans and,
until there is some Disney publication which at least furthers this
concept, I see no reason to account for or discount it in the HooZoo
at this time.
AND....
Not to contradict "The Maestro" :-) (David Gerstein) , since I do
respect what you say and have said in the past, but...
David Gerstein wrote:
> Actually, it happened *faster* than you suggest:
I agree with the timing. As I said, "as the story progressed..." I meant
indeed that the story itself revealed that they were indeed Mickey's
genetic nephews, but I was referring to the fact that, in the beginning (of
the story) there was no genetic connection inferred.
> As for Mrs. Fieldmouse, she wasn't lost to obscurity. She returned
to pick the nephews up after their first visit to Mickey in 1932;
I agree with this too... the "obscurity" comment was meant in the sense
that she doesn't reappear in any future stories (to my knowledge...), but
then you write....
> a 1939 story mentioned her again;
I didn't know that... thanks. :-)
> and at Egmont we frequently show her today.
> In Egmont continuity, the kids live with her when they're not with
> Mickey. And yes, in our continuity she is Mickey's sister. She has
> to be, if the kids are to be real nephews.
That makes perfect sense... just as Daisy's neices live with her sister,
their mother, when they are not visiting Daisy.
> The name Amalia (note spelling; I used to be wrong about this, too)
> is actually her Dutch name, not her Italian one. In Egmont stories,
> she has the English first name of Felicity.
So the name is "Felicity Fieldmouse" then, eh? Thanks. ;-) Has a "Mr.
Fieldmouse" ever appeared or any mention of his whereabouts?
As for Minnie's nieces,
> Actually, to the best of my knowledge, there's one story where
> they're called Melody and Millicent, and one story where they're
> Pammy and Tammy. The names didn't formally change from one to the
> other. More like two stories were written, one without knowledge
> of the other.
Both stories
"The Late, Late Show" October, 1962
http://stp.ling.uu.se/cgi-bin/starback/dcml/story?W+01518+A-06
"Mickey's Close Call" July, 1963
http://stp.ling.uu.se/cgi-bin/starback/dcml/story?W+MM+88-05
which I found while scouring my collection looking for possible
Twin nieces for Minnie several years ago, were drawn by Paul
Murry, who, at least artistically, insinuated that they were
the same nieces. The writer for both stories, who is unknown,
either did not know of the other story, or did not care.
Melody, by herself, was created by Jim Fletcher for the Studio
as I understand it, and was used much more frequently in comics
published for European and South American audiences. Fortunately,
I have many of those Melody stories, even though she is sadly
a very disliked character among the DCMLers. I just think she's
very misunderstood ;-).
About "Millie & Tillie."
> Those names are actually the Danish names, which I discovered
> were used verbatim on an old Egmont character list, and which
> were never used anywhere in English.
Interesting. Thanks.
> So they're no longer official. Since 1999, the official reference
> names we use at Egmont are Millie and Melody.
> The beauty of those names, BTW, is that they allow us to be
> consistent all the time. When there are two, it's Millie and
> Melody, and when the girl is singular, it's Melody.
Which was my own contention and speculation too, way back when we
were first discussing the relationships of the singular "Melody"
and the Twins "Melody & Millicent" on the DCML several years ago.
I'm glad to see that at least Egmont concurs. Did Egmont make
this change to model Dave Smith's "Archive" or was it decided
independently?
Thanks for clearing that all up, David.
Of course, this all began when I questioned the DCML, back in the
beginning of the List (1992???) about the reference to Minnie's
Niece as "Molly." I was glad to help see the change in at least
that one reference, and to learn so much about Minnie's relations.
Thanks,
Rich Bellacera
xephyr at cwnet.com
--------------------------------------------------------------------
mail2web - Check your email from the web at
http://mail2web.com/ .
David Gerstein
Of Ducks & Mice
Message 157 -
2002-10-29 at 23:31:50
Hey Rich?
>Not to contradict "The Maestro" :-) (David Gerstein)
Yoicks! First of all, I'm no Maestro, and I apologize if I sounded
snooty. That ain't all I've got to apologize for, either...
>> Actually, it happened *faster* than you suggest:
>
>I agree with the timing. As I said, "as the story progressed..."
Aargh! So you *were* actually talking about that one 1932 story all
along! And I misunderstood you... (I took "as the story progressed" to mean
"as Disney comics history progressed").
Sorry about the flub.
>So the name is "Felicity Fieldmouse" then, eh? Thanks. ;-) Has a "Mr.
>Fieldmouse" ever appeared or any mention of his whereabouts?
The Egmont writer's guide on the Fieldmouse family, created by Lars
Bergstr?m and Paul Halas, calls Felicity's husband Frank Fieldmouse. The
character hasn't been in a story yet, though, or even mentioned in one, so I
wouldn't call it canon.
>Fortunately, I have many of those Melody stories, even though she is sadly
>a very disliked character among the DCMLers. I just think she's very
>misunderstood ;-).
Hey, I like Melody as a character, and the annoying way she bedevils
Morty and Ferdie? I just don't personally like the art of most stories she's
in. BTW, do you have any Melody stories in English?
>Did Egmont make this change to model Dave Smith's "Archive" or was it decided
>independently?
Independently.
Till soon, David
>Not to contradict "The Maestro" :-) (David Gerstein)
Yoicks! First of all, I'm no Maestro, and I apologize if I sounded
snooty. That ain't all I've got to apologize for, either...
>> Actually, it happened *faster* than you suggest:
>
>I agree with the timing. As I said, "as the story progressed..."
Aargh! So you *were* actually talking about that one 1932 story all
along! And I misunderstood you... (I took "as the story progressed" to mean
"as Disney comics history progressed").
Sorry about the flub.
>So the name is "Felicity Fieldmouse" then, eh? Thanks. ;-) Has a "Mr.
>Fieldmouse" ever appeared or any mention of his whereabouts?
The Egmont writer's guide on the Fieldmouse family, created by Lars
Bergstr?m and Paul Halas, calls Felicity's husband Frank Fieldmouse. The
character hasn't been in a story yet, though, or even mentioned in one, so I
wouldn't call it canon.
>Fortunately, I have many of those Melody stories, even though she is sadly
>a very disliked character among the DCMLers. I just think she's very
>misunderstood ;-).
Hey, I like Melody as a character, and the annoying way she bedevils
Morty and Ferdie? I just don't personally like the art of most stories she's
in. BTW, do you have any Melody stories in English?
>Did Egmont make this change to model Dave Smith's "Archive" or was it decided
>independently?
Independently.
Till soon, David
Xephyr
Of Ducks & Mice
Message 158 -
2002-10-30 at 00:16:23
David-
> Yoicks! First of all, I'm no Maestro, and I apologize if I
> sounded snooty. That ain't all I've got to apologize for,
> either...
Oh, I don't take you as being "snooty." :-) I just respect
your opinion and your great knowlegde/research in Disney
comics! Hence the term "Maestro." :-)
> Sorry about the flub.
No worries. I just wanted to assure you that we were on the "same
page" with that information.
> The Egmont writer's guide on the Fieldmouse family, created by
> Lars Bergstr?m and Paul Halas, calls Felicity's husband Frank
> Fieldmouse. The character hasn't been in a story yet, though,
> or even mentioned in one, so I wouldn't call it canon.
Frank & Felicity Fieldmouse! As dumb assome might think it to be,
I really do love the use of alliteration for Disney characters. :-)
> Hey, I like Melody as a character, and the annoying way she
> bedevils Morty and Ferdie.
Cool. I wasn't sure where you stood with her, but I recall some
discussion about how much some among us dislike her. She's one of
the few characters who can play off of Morty & Ferdie well. The
obvious other being Pluto. M&F have so few supporting characters.
> I just don't personally like the art of most stories she's in.
Oh, I see. Yah, Jim Fletcher's art is kind of childish and simple.
I'm not a big fan either, but I do like those little curls that
he gave Melody which gives her some personal distinction. While
Morty & Ferdie, aside from their caps, look basically like mini
versions of Mickey, and Minnie's Twins were drawn by Paul Murray
as mini versions of Minnie.... i.e., no real distinctive
characteristics. I also have a special fondness for comics which
feature the "kids" of the adult characters (whether they be actual
children or just relations of). That's why I liked some of the
older shared comics on the List which featured large groupings
of them (such as the one with Von Drake explaining the "History of
Computers," or the "Kids Club," both of which featured Melody,
Morty, Ferdie, Newton, Gilbert, Heuy, Dewey & Louie!) I also
noticed that Maria's (Rosinha) niece, Gabby, seems to play the
same role as Melody does to Carioca's Nephews (which makes sense
since Zico & Zeca were basically modelled on Morty & Ferdie).
> BTW, do you have any Melody stories in English?
I may have one, but I can recall which at the moment. I'll see
if I can find it. Otherwise, all of them are either in Italian
or Portaguese (Brazil), and maybe one in Danish? I even have one
story from an issue of Almanacco Topolino where Minnie is portrayed
as a Scout Mistress for a troop of little mice girls all looking
like Melody.
BTW, in a previous comment, I think from Melody's entry on the DCML
Character List, you said that Egmont published only a few stories
with Minnie's twin nieces (then called "Millie & Tillie"). Can you
tell me if these were "new" stories, or just reprints of "The Late,
Late Show" & "Mickey's Close Call" with their names changed? I'm
just curious if Minnie's Nieces (Melody & Millie) can be attributed
to any other stories aside from those two?
I THINK I recall another American published story where the Twins
appear with Mickey, but they were not named, and I don't think I
mentioned it, or maybe I didn't refer to it, in the past as it didn't
further the discussion about their names. So, I *think* there were
at least THREE published stories in the USA featuring Minnie's
"nieces." Sadly, all three did not help collaborate their naming.
Thanks again,
Rich Bellacera
xephyr at cwnet.com
--------------------------------------------------------------------
mail2web - Check your email from the web at
http://mail2web.com/ .
> Yoicks! First of all, I'm no Maestro, and I apologize if I
> sounded snooty. That ain't all I've got to apologize for,
> either...
Oh, I don't take you as being "snooty." :-) I just respect
your opinion and your great knowlegde/research in Disney
comics! Hence the term "Maestro." :-)
> Sorry about the flub.
No worries. I just wanted to assure you that we were on the "same
page" with that information.
> The Egmont writer's guide on the Fieldmouse family, created by
> Lars Bergstr?m and Paul Halas, calls Felicity's husband Frank
> Fieldmouse. The character hasn't been in a story yet, though,
> or even mentioned in one, so I wouldn't call it canon.
Frank & Felicity Fieldmouse! As dumb assome might think it to be,
I really do love the use of alliteration for Disney characters. :-)
> Hey, I like Melody as a character, and the annoying way she
> bedevils Morty and Ferdie.
Cool. I wasn't sure where you stood with her, but I recall some
discussion about how much some among us dislike her. She's one of
the few characters who can play off of Morty & Ferdie well. The
obvious other being Pluto. M&F have so few supporting characters.
> I just don't personally like the art of most stories she's in.
Oh, I see. Yah, Jim Fletcher's art is kind of childish and simple.
I'm not a big fan either, but I do like those little curls that
he gave Melody which gives her some personal distinction. While
Morty & Ferdie, aside from their caps, look basically like mini
versions of Mickey, and Minnie's Twins were drawn by Paul Murray
as mini versions of Minnie.... i.e., no real distinctive
characteristics. I also have a special fondness for comics which
feature the "kids" of the adult characters (whether they be actual
children or just relations of). That's why I liked some of the
older shared comics on the List which featured large groupings
of them (such as the one with Von Drake explaining the "History of
Computers," or the "Kids Club," both of which featured Melody,
Morty, Ferdie, Newton, Gilbert, Heuy, Dewey & Louie!) I also
noticed that Maria's (Rosinha) niece, Gabby, seems to play the
same role as Melody does to Carioca's Nephews (which makes sense
since Zico & Zeca were basically modelled on Morty & Ferdie).
> BTW, do you have any Melody stories in English?
I may have one, but I can recall which at the moment. I'll see
if I can find it. Otherwise, all of them are either in Italian
or Portaguese (Brazil), and maybe one in Danish? I even have one
story from an issue of Almanacco Topolino where Minnie is portrayed
as a Scout Mistress for a troop of little mice girls all looking
like Melody.
BTW, in a previous comment, I think from Melody's entry on the DCML
Character List, you said that Egmont published only a few stories
with Minnie's twin nieces (then called "Millie & Tillie"). Can you
tell me if these were "new" stories, or just reprints of "The Late,
Late Show" & "Mickey's Close Call" with their names changed? I'm
just curious if Minnie's Nieces (Melody & Millie) can be attributed
to any other stories aside from those two?
I THINK I recall another American published story where the Twins
appear with Mickey, but they were not named, and I don't think I
mentioned it, or maybe I didn't refer to it, in the past as it didn't
further the discussion about their names. So, I *think* there were
at least THREE published stories in the USA featuring Minnie's
"nieces." Sadly, all three did not help collaborate their naming.
Thanks again,
Rich Bellacera
xephyr at cwnet.com
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Xephyr
Disney Family Trees
Message 159 -
2002-10-30 at 01:12:25
I just had a silly thought while re-reading my previous posting:
> Personally, I find it comforting to know that in most cases,
> at least everyone being included in these Trees are within
> the same species groups (Ducks & Geese), but when Barks or
> Van Horn throws in Gyro (a "Chicken") I get confused. LOL! :-)
> Something just doesn't seem "right" about that.
Throwing Gyro into the Family Tree brings a whole new meaning
to the phrase, "A chicken in every pot." LOL! :-)
*sigh* I'm probably the only one who finds that funny.
-Rich
xephyr at cwnet.com
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> Personally, I find it comforting to know that in most cases,
> at least everyone being included in these Trees are within
> the same species groups (Ducks & Geese), but when Barks or
> Van Horn throws in Gyro (a "Chicken") I get confused. LOL! :-)
> Something just doesn't seem "right" about that.
Throwing Gyro into the Family Tree brings a whole new meaning
to the phrase, "A chicken in every pot." LOL! :-)
*sigh* I'm probably the only one who finds that funny.
-Rich
xephyr at cwnet.com
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SRoweCanoe
David Gerstein's posts and AOL
Message 160 -
2002-10-30 at 01:56:19
just wondering why i dont recieve David Gerstein's dcml postings ---
is everybody on aol not getting them or just me?
steven rowe
is everybody on aol not getting them or just me?
steven rowe
Fernando Ventura
Rosinha's niece!
Message 161 -
2002-10-30 at 07:52:56
Rich:
>I also noticed that Maria's (Rosinha) niece, Gabby, seems to play the
>same role as Melody does to Carioca's Nephews (which makes sense
>since Zico & Zeca were basically modelled on Morty & Ferdie).
Good point, Rich! It's interisting to say that she's created by Primaggio
Mantovi...maybe Arthur can answer this better, but I think the code of her
first story was from 1993, but it's only published in 1999 (I'm with few
time to check it, I need to sleeeeeeepy)!
Hum...I know I like and HAVE strange art, but I really like Jim Fletcher's
draw! :-)
No answers about my Sunday Strip's Z? Carioca question?
Oh, please!!! I need more accurate information for an (not so) future
article!
See you my friends!
Fernandozzzzzzzzzz...RONC!
>I also noticed that Maria's (Rosinha) niece, Gabby, seems to play the
>same role as Melody does to Carioca's Nephews (which makes sense
>since Zico & Zeca were basically modelled on Morty & Ferdie).
Good point, Rich! It's interisting to say that she's created by Primaggio
Mantovi...maybe Arthur can answer this better, but I think the code of her
first story was from 1993, but it's only published in 1999 (I'm with few
time to check it, I need to sleeeeeeepy)!
Hum...I know I like and HAVE strange art, but I really like Jim Fletcher's
draw! :-)
No answers about my Sunday Strip's Z? Carioca question?
Oh, please!!! I need more accurate information for an (not so) future
article!
See you my friends!
Fernandozzzzzzzzzz...RONC!
Ola Martinsson
Thanks for DD dailies ! and the Mickey Quiz answer
Message 162 -
2002-10-30 at 15:13:18
Thank you very much to those who answered my query for Norwegian Donald
Duck dailies.
And there don't seem to be any interest in the quiz but anyway here is
the answer all the same, The ruby eye of Homar-guy-am. A quite enyoable
story me thinks.
Ola in cloudy Stockholm +5
Duck dailies.
And there don't seem to be any interest in the quiz but anyway here is
the answer all the same, The ruby eye of Homar-guy-am. A quite enyoable
story me thinks.
Ola in cloudy Stockholm +5
Arthur Faria Jr.
Rich, Fernando: Rosinha's niece!
Message 163 -
2002-10-31 at 05:56:41
Rich wrote:
>>I also noticed that Maria's (Rosinha) niece, Gabby, seems to play the
>>same role as Melody does to Carioca's Nephews (which makes sense
>>since Zico & Zeca were basically modelled on Morty & Ferdie).
And Fernando replied:
> Good point, Rich! It's interisting to say that she's created by Primaggio
> Mantovi...maybe Arthur can answer this better, but I think the code of her
> first story was from 1993, but it's only published in 1999
All Brazilian stories where Gabi appears were published in 1996, 1997 and
2000,
*except* one that is from 1992. But as far as I know, this one is an old
unused non-Disney script created by Abril Jovem studio (when they
used to produce even non-Disney scripts) which was adapted later to become
a Joe Carioca story. So, the first Gabi's story is in fact B 960233 "Boca
Livre",
where Rosinha introduces Carioca to her newly-arrived niece (and then Joe
has
to wear a silly Easter rabbit costume just to amuse the spoiled girl).
And, Rich:
There are 10 stories with Gabi, but only two of them
feature Gabi annoying Zico and Zeca (Carioca's nephews) in
a way somewhat similar to Melody with Mickey's nephews.
Gabi usually annoys Carioca himself every time he tries to go
out with Rosinha (and Rosinha's father, Rocha Vaz, really
enjoys that! ;-)
-- Arthur.
>>I also noticed that Maria's (Rosinha) niece, Gabby, seems to play the
>>same role as Melody does to Carioca's Nephews (which makes sense
>>since Zico & Zeca were basically modelled on Morty & Ferdie).
And Fernando replied:
> Good point, Rich! It's interisting to say that she's created by Primaggio
> Mantovi...maybe Arthur can answer this better, but I think the code of her
> first story was from 1993, but it's only published in 1999
All Brazilian stories where Gabi appears were published in 1996, 1997 and
2000,
*except* one that is from 1992. But as far as I know, this one is an old
unused non-Disney script created by Abril Jovem studio (when they
used to produce even non-Disney scripts) which was adapted later to become
a Joe Carioca story. So, the first Gabi's story is in fact B 960233 "Boca
Livre",
where Rosinha introduces Carioca to her newly-arrived niece (and then Joe
has
to wear a silly Easter rabbit costume just to amuse the spoiled girl).
And, Rich:
There are 10 stories with Gabi, but only two of them
feature Gabi annoying Zico and Zeca (Carioca's nephews) in
a way somewhat similar to Melody with Mickey's nephews.
Gabi usually annoys Carioca himself every time he tries to go
out with Rosinha (and Rosinha's father, Rocha Vaz, really
enjoys that! ;-)
-- Arthur.
Xephyr
Rosinha's niece!
Message 164 -
2002-10-31 at 21:59:33
Arthur Faria Jr. said:
> All Brazilian stories where Gabi appears were published in 1996,
> 1997 and 2000, *except* one that is from 1992. But as far as I
> know, this one is an old unused non-Disney script created by
> Abril Jovem studio (when they used to produce even non-Disney
> scripts) which was adapted later to become a Joe Carioca story.
Interesting. So Gabi was created for the Carioca Universe in
order to adapt this unused non-Disney script? Now she is a regular.
Thanks for that insight.
> So, the first Gabi's story is in fact B 960233 "Boca Livre",
> where Rosinha introduces Carioca to her newly-arrived niece
> (and then Joe has to wear a silly Easter rabbit costume just
> to amuse the spoiled girl).
I have this comic! :-) I didn't know that was her first appearance.
> There are 10 stories with Gabi, but only two of them
> feature Gabi annoying Zico and Zeca (Carioca's nephews) in
> a way somewhat similar to Melody with Mickey's nephews.
Hmmm. Now I wonder if Gabi has a "twin" (like Melody & Millie),
too? Of course, her twin's name would have to be Xena.
Just kidding. LOL! :-)
> Gabi usually annoys Carioca himself every time he tries to
> go out with Rosinha (and Rosinha's father, Rocha Vaz, really
> enjoys that! ;-)
Then, do you think *that* is her primary role in the Carioca
Universe? Poor Jose. He has such a laundry list of bad things
that are just waiting for him when he awakes each day. :-)
Thanks,
Rich Bellacera
xephyr at cwnet.com
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> All Brazilian stories where Gabi appears were published in 1996,
> 1997 and 2000, *except* one that is from 1992. But as far as I
> know, this one is an old unused non-Disney script created by
> Abril Jovem studio (when they used to produce even non-Disney
> scripts) which was adapted later to become a Joe Carioca story.
Interesting. So Gabi was created for the Carioca Universe in
order to adapt this unused non-Disney script? Now she is a regular.
Thanks for that insight.
> So, the first Gabi's story is in fact B 960233 "Boca Livre",
> where Rosinha introduces Carioca to her newly-arrived niece
> (and then Joe has to wear a silly Easter rabbit costume just
> to amuse the spoiled girl).
I have this comic! :-) I didn't know that was her first appearance.
> There are 10 stories with Gabi, but only two of them
> feature Gabi annoying Zico and Zeca (Carioca's nephews) in
> a way somewhat similar to Melody with Mickey's nephews.
Hmmm. Now I wonder if Gabi has a "twin" (like Melody & Millie),
too? Of course, her twin's name would have to be Xena.
Just kidding. LOL! :-)
> Gabi usually annoys Carioca himself every time he tries to
> go out with Rosinha (and Rosinha's father, Rocha Vaz, really
> enjoys that! ;-)
Then, do you think *that* is her primary role in the Carioca
Universe? Poor Jose. He has such a laundry list of bad things
that are just waiting for him when he awakes each day. :-)
Thanks,
Rich Bellacera
xephyr at cwnet.com
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