Here is an example of Carol Voges' Disney art
http://www.geocities.com/roland3066/nl_71_24.jpg
Some Voges stories were published in Picsou and le journal de Mickey.
Francois
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/cgi-bin/search.uk.php
Author
Topic: 200101
(249 messages)
François Willot
Carol Voges
Message 106 -
2001-01-14 at 22:18:24
Pascal Oost
DCML digest, Vol 1 #376 (Carol Voges, 1925-2001)
Message 107 -
2001-01-15 at 00:42:02
Op 14-01-2001 12:05 schreef dcml-request at stp.ling.uu.se
<dcml-request at stp.ling.uu.se>:
>> Dutch artist Carol Voges died last Tuesday. This was in
>> my newspaper yesterday. Carol is remembered mostly by his non-Disney things.
>> But in a smaller circle he is also famous for drawing the ugliest Duck
>> characters of the 1970s. In a recent interview he said "he never objected"
>> to making Disney stories. I think his work showed that attitude...
>
> I disagree. I consider Voges' Duck art even very good. We already talked about
> this, Harry, but I want other list members to know about my "second opinion",
> so they won't take yours for a scientific fact. To me, there's no such thing
> as
> bad Voges art.
> Asking Harry what should be so bad about Voges' Duck drawings,
> he answered with an argument about lots of little lines depicting motion. I
> hardly see them.
> Other Dutch list members here with any expressed opinion about
> Voges' Disney art?
Carol Voges as an artist had his own, very distinct style. This made his
Disney-comics instantly recognizable as made-by-Voges instead of
made-by-Disney.
His style was not flamboyant, experimental, sketchy or flashy. His drawings
had robust, solid feel to them. And indeed, because his characters looked a
little motionless, he sometimes overdid it in the speed lines-department,
trying to suggest movement.
I would not ask Carol Voges to draw fast and furious Barks-like adventures
for experienced readers. But for a very young audience, that needs to have
their Disney comics presented clearly and comprehensible, he may have been
the best.
I understand why not many people will choose Carol Voges as their favorite
Disney artist. Personally, I consider him to have been a great craftsman and
one of the greatest comic professionals who worked in the Netherlands in the
last more-than-fifty years.
Pascal Oost
<dcml-request at stp.ling.uu.se>:
>> Dutch artist Carol Voges died last Tuesday. This was in
>> my newspaper yesterday. Carol is remembered mostly by his non-Disney things.
>> But in a smaller circle he is also famous for drawing the ugliest Duck
>> characters of the 1970s. In a recent interview he said "he never objected"
>> to making Disney stories. I think his work showed that attitude...
>
> I disagree. I consider Voges' Duck art even very good. We already talked about
> this, Harry, but I want other list members to know about my "second opinion",
> so they won't take yours for a scientific fact. To me, there's no such thing
> as
> bad Voges art.
> Asking Harry what should be so bad about Voges' Duck drawings,
> he answered with an argument about lots of little lines depicting motion. I
> hardly see them.
> Other Dutch list members here with any expressed opinion about
> Voges' Disney art?
Carol Voges as an artist had his own, very distinct style. This made his
Disney-comics instantly recognizable as made-by-Voges instead of
made-by-Disney.
His style was not flamboyant, experimental, sketchy or flashy. His drawings
had robust, solid feel to them. And indeed, because his characters looked a
little motionless, he sometimes overdid it in the speed lines-department,
trying to suggest movement.
I would not ask Carol Voges to draw fast and furious Barks-like adventures
for experienced readers. But for a very young audience, that needs to have
their Disney comics presented clearly and comprehensible, he may have been
the best.
I understand why not many people will choose Carol Voges as their favorite
Disney artist. Personally, I consider him to have been a great craftsman and
one of the greatest comic professionals who worked in the Netherlands in the
last more-than-fifty years.
Pascal Oost
BFOSTERLA
Donald Duck Comic Strip
Message 108 -
2001-01-15 at 02:13:31
Thank you, Rob Klein.
Yes, I wrote the Duck strip from 1980 through 1990, daily and Sunday, and
I have boxes full of the original roughs. I always wrote in "storyboard"
format. When I edited Donald Duck Adventures, Uncle Scrooge Adventures,
DuckTales and Walt Disney's Comics and Stories I almost always did a layout
sketch for the covers, and I have most of those, too. I was always delighted
by the final artwork that artists interpreted from my sketches. Their
problem was putting the characters on model while trying to retain some of
the attitudes I had put into the roughs. A real challenge! The solutions
they came up with were always impressive. If DCML readers are interested, and
if I can figure out how to scan and send, I'd be happy to post some of the
roughs next to copies of the final art so DCML members can see what a great
job the artists did (for educational purposes, of course.) I've recently
moved, so I'd have to dig things out of storage, but give me some time and
I'll see what I can come up with.
Bob Foster
Yes, I wrote the Duck strip from 1980 through 1990, daily and Sunday, and
I have boxes full of the original roughs. I always wrote in "storyboard"
format. When I edited Donald Duck Adventures, Uncle Scrooge Adventures,
DuckTales and Walt Disney's Comics and Stories I almost always did a layout
sketch for the covers, and I have most of those, too. I was always delighted
by the final artwork that artists interpreted from my sketches. Their
problem was putting the characters on model while trying to retain some of
the attitudes I had put into the roughs. A real challenge! The solutions
they came up with were always impressive. If DCML readers are interested, and
if I can figure out how to scan and send, I'd be happy to post some of the
roughs next to copies of the final art so DCML members can see what a great
job the artists did (for educational purposes, of course.) I've recently
moved, so I'd have to dig things out of storage, but give me some time and
I'll see what I can come up with.
Bob Foster
Rob Klein
Carol Voges' Ducks II
Message 109 -
2001-01-15 at 08:48:28
This is an addendum to my comments on Carol Voges: Sorry, the separate
middle group of artists starting with Eddy van Schuylenburg, are artists
whose "Duck" work is in a middle group of my taste. To Harry, Henri or
Daniel or Arthur: perhaps one of you can put a few examples of Voges' funny
animal work AND his human figure work on a website for all the members to
view his ample drawing skills. Rob Klein
middle group of artists starting with Eddy van Schuylenburg, are artists
whose "Duck" work is in a middle group of my taste. To Harry, Henri or
Daniel or Arthur: perhaps one of you can put a few examples of Voges' funny
animal work AND his human figure work on a website for all the members to
view his ample drawing skills. Rob Klein
Frank Stajano
Carol Voges
Message 110 -
2001-01-15 at 09:52:07
At 2001-01-14 21:18 +0100, Fran?ois Willot wrote:
>Here is an example of Carol Voges' Disney art
>http://www.geocities.com/roland3066/nl_71_24.jpg
Hey, Harry, nothing to write home about, but at least it's a clean stroke
and the characters have more or less the right proportions. Graphically,
I'd class it in the limbo of all these worthless S-coded ones, but not
below. There's at least half a dozen "artists", if not more, that I would
rank as definitely much worse than this. IMHO, of course.
Frank (filologo disneyano) http://www.uk.research.att.com/~fms/
>Here is an example of Carol Voges' Disney art
>http://www.geocities.com/roland3066/nl_71_24.jpg
Hey, Harry, nothing to write home about, but at least it's a clean stroke
and the characters have more or less the right proportions. Graphically,
I'd class it in the limbo of all these worthless S-coded ones, but not
below. There's at least half a dozen "artists", if not more, that I would
rank as definitely much worse than this. IMHO, of course.
Frank (filologo disneyano) http://www.uk.research.att.com/~fms/
Santiago Garcia Banhos
Past again
Message 111 -
2001-01-15 at 10:49:47
Candico86 at aol.com:
>This might be asking a little bit much but if it would be possible to
>anyone who posses any comics or books or anything to make a small list of
>things he did, I would like it very much. Thank you to anyone who would
>make the time to do so.
I think you'd better take a look at Dan Shane's Life Of Scrooge's page (if
you haven't already):
http://personal.atl.bellsouth.net/sdf/d/a/danshane/scroopage/scroohome.htm
Santiago.
>This might be asking a little bit much but if it would be possible to
>anyone who posses any comics or books or anything to make a small list of
>things he did, I would like it very much. Thank you to anyone who would
>make the time to do so.
I think you'd better take a look at Dan Shane's Life Of Scrooge's page (if
you haven't already):
http://personal.atl.bellsouth.net/sdf/d/a/danshane/scroopage/scroohome.htm
Santiago.
Fluks, H.W.
Oost
Message 112 -
2001-01-15 at 11:13:50
> From: Pascal Oost [mailto:poost at casema.net]
Ah! Another celebrity that we can add to our list ("Which celebrities are
member of DCML").
Pascal Oost wrote several stories for the Dutch Donald Duck weekly and
related magazines, including an enjoyable story for KATRIEN. Katrien is a
new Dutch periodical meant for girls, but not forbidden for 38-year old
boys... 8-)
--Harry.
Ah! Another celebrity that we can add to our list ("Which celebrities are
member of DCML").
Pascal Oost wrote several stories for the Dutch Donald Duck weekly and
related magazines, including an enjoyable story for KATRIEN. Katrien is a
new Dutch periodical meant for girls, but not forbidden for 38-year old
boys... 8-)
--Harry.
Fluks, H.W.
Henri: Carol Voges
Message 113 -
2001-01-15 at 11:19:47
Henri:
> I consider Voges' Duck art even very good. We
> already talked about
> this, Harry, but I want other list members to know about my
> "second opinion",
> so they won't take yours for a scientific fact.
Of course my opinion is not a scientific fact. I'm not sure why you think
anyone would think it is.
I'm not surprised you like Voges' work. For every artist there is or has
been at least one fan who says his/her work is very good. My most favourite
artists to dislike are Perego, Lockman, and Voges. And now I know that all
three of them have a bunch of true fans too. 8-)
--Harry.
> I consider Voges' Duck art even very good. We
> already talked about
> this, Harry, but I want other list members to know about my
> "second opinion",
> so they won't take yours for a scientific fact.
Of course my opinion is not a scientific fact. I'm not sure why you think
anyone would think it is.
I'm not surprised you like Voges' work. For every artist there is or has
been at least one fan who says his/her work is very good. My most favourite
artists to dislike are Perego, Lockman, and Voges. And now I know that all
three of them have a bunch of true fans too. 8-)
--Harry.
Marco Barlotti
FMS on The Master Rainmaker
Message 114 -
2001-01-15 at 11:40:44
At 11.32 14/01/01 +0000, Frank Stajano wrote:
[http://marcobar.cce.unifi.it/DCML/pato1.jpg]
>
>So what were the differences that YOU wanted to point out? (What I missed
>was that the whole story was retraced)
>
Well, that was the main "feature" that struck me as quite unusual.
Marco
[http://marcobar.cce.unifi.it/DCML/pato1.jpg]
>
>So what were the differences that YOU wanted to point out? (What I missed
>was that the whole story was retraced)
>
Well, that was the main "feature" that struck me as quite unusual.
Marco
Santiago Garcia Banhos
FMS on The Master Rainmaker
Message 115 -
2001-01-15 at 13:35:30
Marco:
>The Spanish enlarged the first and the last panels, which were (partly?)
>redrawn. However, the peculiar fact is that the WHOLE story was TRACED
>(it's a "lucido" in the Italian jargon).
Could you upload two scans of the original version of those pages, for us to
compare? (Now, if you got the orignal issue, it's undestood).
Thanks.
Santiago.
>The Spanish enlarged the first and the last panels, which were (partly?)
>redrawn. However, the peculiar fact is that the WHOLE story was TRACED
>(it's a "lucido" in the Italian jargon).
Could you upload two scans of the original version of those pages, for us to
compare? (Now, if you got the orignal issue, it's undestood).
Thanks.
Santiago.
Fernando Ventura
Re-Reply to Bob Foster!
Message 116 -
2001-01-15 at 13:37:12
>The Disney licensee in Brazil (is it Abril?)
Yes, it is!
contacted Disney Publishing in
>Burbank and requested some stories for their publications in Brazil.
Strange! They made some Hunchback histories, with writing of G?rson
Teixeira, very good brazilian writer!
I was
>asked to create several short stories (6 - 8 pages, as I recall) using the
>Hercules characters, and that's probably what you saw. I've never seen any
>of the stories. I wrote them in script form (typewritten), not in
>"storyboard" form, so there are no sketches.]
First I like to say that the stories are very good! Congratulations!
I saw 6 Hercules histories:
B 980003-O Clube de Gin?stica de H?rcules (Pain and Panic do some exercises
on Hercule's academy)
B 980003a-Os Est?bulos de Augias (Hercules makes a local to the future
marriage of the 50 ths daughters of the King of ?lida)
B 980011-Trabalhando em Equipe (Herc and his father learning how to work
together)
B 980001a-O Monstro de Tebas (Hades create a new Titan, Taggus Graffitus)
B 980015-Passeio Perigoso (Young Hercules need to repair his parent's fence)
B 980004- As Tarefas de H?rcules (Young Hercules has some problems to put
the trash out of the house)
You can confirm this histories as your? And if this are by you, there are
some that I forgot? I like to ask you, too, if you are the writer of some
others short histories, with Mulan and Tarzan, that are draw on Brazil too?
Thank You, Very Much!!!
Fernando!
Yes, it is!
contacted Disney Publishing in
>Burbank and requested some stories for their publications in Brazil.
Strange! They made some Hunchback histories, with writing of G?rson
Teixeira, very good brazilian writer!
I was
>asked to create several short stories (6 - 8 pages, as I recall) using the
>Hercules characters, and that's probably what you saw. I've never seen any
>of the stories. I wrote them in script form (typewritten), not in
>"storyboard" form, so there are no sketches.]
First I like to say that the stories are very good! Congratulations!
I saw 6 Hercules histories:
B 980003-O Clube de Gin?stica de H?rcules (Pain and Panic do some exercises
on Hercule's academy)
B 980003a-Os Est?bulos de Augias (Hercules makes a local to the future
marriage of the 50 ths daughters of the King of ?lida)
B 980011-Trabalhando em Equipe (Herc and his father learning how to work
together)
B 980001a-O Monstro de Tebas (Hades create a new Titan, Taggus Graffitus)
B 980015-Passeio Perigoso (Young Hercules need to repair his parent's fence)
B 980004- As Tarefas de H?rcules (Young Hercules has some problems to put
the trash out of the house)
You can confirm this histories as your? And if this are by you, there are
some that I forgot? I like to ask you, too, if you are the writer of some
others short histories, with Mulan and Tarzan, that are draw on Brazil too?
Thank You, Very Much!!!
Fernando!
Sandven, Halvor
How good are the artists?
Message 117 -
2001-01-15 at 17:25:50
Hello!
I have read the discussion about the quality of Carol Voges art. Personally
I don't like it very much, but that's beside the point. It's obvious that
art that someone consider awful, somebody else likes a lot. I have my own
opinion on how good the different artists are, and so I have tried to give
each artist a grade. By doing this I have made a system that uses INDUCKS
and finds how the quality in the danish, dutch and german weekly has changed
thru the years. This may be known to some of you, as I have mentioned this
in a previous mail to this list. The results are plotted in a Excel-diagram,
and can be seen in a graph. I have also tried to take into consideration
that some artists have changed their style thru the years. An example would
be Murry. I consider his early work to be very good, but the things he did
the last years, were not really that hot. I know that this way of finding
the quality may not be perfect, because there are many things that are
difficult to take into consideration, but I believe that the results
correspond with the feeling I've got regarding how the quality of the danish
weekly is for each year.
It would be interesting to see how the results would change if the artists
were rated by others. I have enclosed the most-used artists in the danish
and dutch weekly with number of pages. If anyone would try to rate these, I
could make their personal results. You can rate any artist you want, but of
course the most-used artists are the most important. For those you don't
rate, I may use my own ratings. If the response is good, I could make the
results by the artists average grade. You may also let me know how artists
change thru the years. You could for example say that a given artist work
before 1975 has the grade 5,0, but later it's 4,0, or you could say that his
or her duck-stories has the grade 3,5 and the other stories has the grade
3,0. In my system the best grade is 6,0, and the worst is 1,0. Decimals may
be used. Also, if the response is good, maybe it would be interesting to
have an official graph showing the quality that most of the members on this
list can agree about? Maybe we could make an 'expert-group' that could agree
upon how the rules for how each artist should be rated thru the years should
be?
I would also like to do this on the italian Topolino, but in the italian
version of INDUCKS there are still many stories with unknown number of
pages. Also, I'm not very familiar with all the italian artists, so I would
need some help here. As the different coutries version of INDUCKS gets more
complete, this can be done for any publication that's updated.
Here are the most-used artists, with their total number of pages in the
danish and dutch weekly: (reprints are counted)
Vicar 9010 4910
Carl Barks 8760 8271
Tony Stobl 6409 3635
Paul Murry 6042 2600
Jack Bradbury 4158 3444
Tello 3309 338
Antonio Gil-Bao 2489 233
Daniel Branca 2435 662
Colomer 1907 1599
Al Hubbard 1635 2415
Toi 1535 26
Santanach 1474 60
Ferioli 1350 46
Al Taliaferro 1269 456
Gil Turner 1187 738
Pete Alavardo 1180 558
Don Rosa 1111 55
Esteban 1087 55
Manuel Gonzales 1057 210
Millet 1053 54
Julio Ramos 871 119
Phil DeLara 839 702
Rodriguez 814 0
Marcal Abella Bresco 778 27
Torres 728 80
Willian VanHorn 689 70
David 640 109
Adrian S?rensen 619 40
Scalabroni 534 88
Marco Rota 533 12
Nunez 512 22
Jim Fletcher 503 504
Harvei Eisenberg 470 615
Jose Cardona Blasi 467 14
Nils Rydahl 465 6
Xavi 435 61
Frank McSavage 424 388
Dick Moores 396 528
Mau Heymans 361 1097
Tello-Team 346 47
Romano Scarpa 327 75
Kay Wright 326 193
Noel vanHorn 324 2
Floyd Gottfredson 308 520
Ben Verhagen 205 548
Freddy Milton 181 653
Daan Jippes 178 442
Bas Heymans 97 303
Mark de Jonge 89 295
Ed van Schuijlenburg 80 380
Comicup Studio 48 810
Carol Voges 34 597
Ed Lukacs 6 302
Bardon 2 382
Dick Matena 0 1143
There are many more, but these are the most-used.
Also, if anyone wants to know more details about my results, or wants to see
my graph, just send me a mail.
---Halvor (halvor.sandven at dnb.no)
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
This email with attachments is solely for the use of the individual or
entity to whom it is addressed. Please also be aware that DnB cannot
accept any payment orders or other legally binding correspondence with
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This email message has been virus checked by the virus programs used
in the DnB Group.
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I have read the discussion about the quality of Carol Voges art. Personally
I don't like it very much, but that's beside the point. It's obvious that
art that someone consider awful, somebody else likes a lot. I have my own
opinion on how good the different artists are, and so I have tried to give
each artist a grade. By doing this I have made a system that uses INDUCKS
and finds how the quality in the danish, dutch and german weekly has changed
thru the years. This may be known to some of you, as I have mentioned this
in a previous mail to this list. The results are plotted in a Excel-diagram,
and can be seen in a graph. I have also tried to take into consideration
that some artists have changed their style thru the years. An example would
be Murry. I consider his early work to be very good, but the things he did
the last years, were not really that hot. I know that this way of finding
the quality may not be perfect, because there are many things that are
difficult to take into consideration, but I believe that the results
correspond with the feeling I've got regarding how the quality of the danish
weekly is for each year.
It would be interesting to see how the results would change if the artists
were rated by others. I have enclosed the most-used artists in the danish
and dutch weekly with number of pages. If anyone would try to rate these, I
could make their personal results. You can rate any artist you want, but of
course the most-used artists are the most important. For those you don't
rate, I may use my own ratings. If the response is good, I could make the
results by the artists average grade. You may also let me know how artists
change thru the years. You could for example say that a given artist work
before 1975 has the grade 5,0, but later it's 4,0, or you could say that his
or her duck-stories has the grade 3,5 and the other stories has the grade
3,0. In my system the best grade is 6,0, and the worst is 1,0. Decimals may
be used. Also, if the response is good, maybe it would be interesting to
have an official graph showing the quality that most of the members on this
list can agree about? Maybe we could make an 'expert-group' that could agree
upon how the rules for how each artist should be rated thru the years should
be?
I would also like to do this on the italian Topolino, but in the italian
version of INDUCKS there are still many stories with unknown number of
pages. Also, I'm not very familiar with all the italian artists, so I would
need some help here. As the different coutries version of INDUCKS gets more
complete, this can be done for any publication that's updated.
Here are the most-used artists, with their total number of pages in the
danish and dutch weekly: (reprints are counted)
Vicar 9010 4910
Carl Barks 8760 8271
Tony Stobl 6409 3635
Paul Murry 6042 2600
Jack Bradbury 4158 3444
Tello 3309 338
Antonio Gil-Bao 2489 233
Daniel Branca 2435 662
Colomer 1907 1599
Al Hubbard 1635 2415
Toi 1535 26
Santanach 1474 60
Ferioli 1350 46
Al Taliaferro 1269 456
Gil Turner 1187 738
Pete Alavardo 1180 558
Don Rosa 1111 55
Esteban 1087 55
Manuel Gonzales 1057 210
Millet 1053 54
Julio Ramos 871 119
Phil DeLara 839 702
Rodriguez 814 0
Marcal Abella Bresco 778 27
Torres 728 80
Willian VanHorn 689 70
David 640 109
Adrian S?rensen 619 40
Scalabroni 534 88
Marco Rota 533 12
Nunez 512 22
Jim Fletcher 503 504
Harvei Eisenberg 470 615
Jose Cardona Blasi 467 14
Nils Rydahl 465 6
Xavi 435 61
Frank McSavage 424 388
Dick Moores 396 528
Mau Heymans 361 1097
Tello-Team 346 47
Romano Scarpa 327 75
Kay Wright 326 193
Noel vanHorn 324 2
Floyd Gottfredson 308 520
Ben Verhagen 205 548
Freddy Milton 181 653
Daan Jippes 178 442
Bas Heymans 97 303
Mark de Jonge 89 295
Ed van Schuijlenburg 80 380
Comicup Studio 48 810
Carol Voges 34 597
Ed Lukacs 6 302
Bardon 2 382
Dick Matena 0 1143
There are many more, but these are the most-used.
Also, if anyone wants to know more details about my results, or wants to see
my graph, just send me a mail.
---Halvor (halvor.sandven at dnb.no)
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
This email with attachments is solely for the use of the individual or
entity to whom it is addressed. Please also be aware that DnB cannot
accept any payment orders or other legally binding correspondence with
customers as a part of an email.
This email message has been virus checked by the virus programs used
in the DnB Group.
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
BFOSTERLA
Reply to Fernando Ventura
Message 118 -
2001-01-15 at 20:12:36
From: "Fernando Ventura" <fernandopventura at uol.com.br>
>I have a question to you! I see on your index of I.N.D.U.C.K.S that you
>wrote a Hercules story that was drawn here in Brazil! You know why it was
>sent to Brazil to be drawn? Maybe they(?) liked the previous drawings of
>some Brazilian histories with this movie's characters?
The Disney licensee in Brazil (is it Abril?) contacted Disney Publishing in
Burbank and requested some stories for their publications in Brazil. I was
asked to create several short stories (6 - 8 pages, as I recall) using the
Hercules characters, and that's probably what you saw. I've never seen any
of the stories. I wrote them in script form (typewritten), not in
"storyboard" form, so there are no sketches.
>I have a question to you! I see on your index of I.N.D.U.C.K.S that you
>wrote a Hercules story that was drawn here in Brazil! You know why it was
>sent to Brazil to be drawn? Maybe they(?) liked the previous drawings of
>some Brazilian histories with this movie's characters?
The Disney licensee in Brazil (is it Abril?) contacted Disney Publishing in
Burbank and requested some stories for their publications in Brazil. I was
asked to create several short stories (6 - 8 pages, as I recall) using the
Hercules characters, and that's probably what you saw. I've never seen any
of the stories. I wrote them in script form (typewritten), not in
"storyboard" form, so there are no sketches.
Luca Boschi
One more Peg-Leg in comic books!
Message 119 -
2001-01-15 at 21:45:02
Hi, all!
Concerning the recently discussed issue abot IF Pete were ALWAYS called
"Black Pete" in the comic books, I found a sort of exception. It is the
story MM and the Hounted House, reprinted in WDC&S 578. Werll, the peg-leg
is in its cover, too. And so Pete is called. The concept and the cover
design are by our friend Bob Foster, indeeed.
But maybe that the correct answer is that the story was conceived to be
printed as a "General Mills" Giveaway "D". So, it seems it was produced
without a "tight supervision" or editing by the Western Printing's crew.
The same is also true for the Xmas Giveaway memtioned by Dave some days ago
("Mickey's Christmas Trees" from Firestone 1946).
Ciao!
Luca
Concerning the recently discussed issue abot IF Pete were ALWAYS called
"Black Pete" in the comic books, I found a sort of exception. It is the
story MM and the Hounted House, reprinted in WDC&S 578. Werll, the peg-leg
is in its cover, too. And so Pete is called. The concept and the cover
design are by our friend Bob Foster, indeeed.
But maybe that the correct answer is that the story was conceived to be
printed as a "General Mills" Giveaway "D". So, it seems it was produced
without a "tight supervision" or editing by the Western Printing's crew.
The same is also true for the Xmas Giveaway memtioned by Dave some days ago
("Mickey's Christmas Trees" from Firestone 1946).
Ciao!
Luca
Henri Kunne
DCML digest, Vol 1 #377 - 15 msgs
Message 120 -
2001-01-15 at 23:16:15
At 09:36 14-1-01, Rob Klein wrote:
>Regarding Henri Kunne's query over opinions on Carol Voges' Ducks:
>
>Hoi Henri!
>I agree with Harry. To me, Carol's Ducks are ugly. Of course, (as Ole
>Reichstein Nielsen pointed out) that is likely because I am measuring the
>quality of all Duck drawings based on my having been introduced to the
>Ducks by seeing Carl Barks' Ducks.
Could well be right. In the early 1960, Strobl was a regular guest in the Dutch
Donald weekly and I still like him (see below).
>I do Not like the Ducks of Carol, Romano Scarpa, post 1958 (1959 and later)
>Tony Strobl work, most of the Italian artists, McSavage, Harry Balm, Danny
>Wanner, Jules Coenen (sometimes), Marc de Jonge, most of the other Western
>Publishing artists, Don Rosa, Paul Murray,many of the Hachette artists,
>many of the Egmont Spanish artists....etc.
>
>Eddy van Schuylenburg, Vicar, Jules Coenen (at his best), Michel Nadorp,
>Endre Lucasz, Carpi, Cavazzano (at his best)
>(....)
>It is a matter of style chosen by the artist, and individual taste of the
>fan.
You are quite right, of course: it's a matter of taste. Hoewever, I want to put
one thing straight. There are two standards to judge Disney art c.q. Duck art
by: is it technically correct? Are the Ducks "cute"? It's clear that you are on
the technical side. This can be seen from your choices: Barks, old Strobl,
and _not_ the Italian artists, not even Scarpa.
I'm on the cute side; so I do like most of the famous Italians,
everything
of Strobl. Of course I'm not exactly a Barks hater <g>, but I read his
stories to read the stories, if you know what I mean. Enjoying nice, charming
art is a different thing. To everyone, his specialism. Voges is one of the cute
Duck artists, and I love his stories for it. (Not as stories indeed,
they're full
of cliches.)
>As you can tell from these lists, my views (....) come from personal taste,
>and do not relate exactly to technical competence of the artist.
As you've read, I do not completely agree with that. I think they do; but
chances are that it's not exactly competence that counts, but the artist's
goal, or specialization.
At 14 Jan 2001 11:37:45, Frank Stajano wrote:
>At 2001-01-13 20:20 +0100, Henri Kunne wrote:
> > Other Dutch list members here with any expressed opinion about
> >Voges' Disney art?
>
>Obvious follow-up: why not putting up a few scans somewhere so that we can
>all form first-hand opinions?
Very good excuse: because I haven't got a scanner at the moment.
At Mon, 15 Jan 2001 10:19:47, Harry Fluks wrote:
>Henri:
> > I consider Voges' Duck art even very good. We
> > already talked about
> > this, Harry, but I want other list members to know about my
> > "second opinion",
> > so they won't take yours for a scientific fact.
>
>Of course my opinion is not a scientific fact. I'm not sure why you think
>anyone would think it is.
Well, maybe I should have put a smiley behind that one. Or said: take
your words for granted. I know nobody will think of science. I cannot see
why you think that I think that they think.... ;-)
>I'm not surprised you like Voges' work. For every artist there is or has
>been at least one fan who says his/her work is very good. My most favourite
>artists to dislike are Perego, Lockman, and Voges. And now I know that all
>three of them have a bunch of true fans too. 8-)
Well, at least we agree about Perego. I'm not exactly fond, either, of his
"rush hour work" in the bean string stories in the very old LTB's.
Greetings, Henri
>Regarding Henri Kunne's query over opinions on Carol Voges' Ducks:
>
>Hoi Henri!
>I agree with Harry. To me, Carol's Ducks are ugly. Of course, (as Ole
>Reichstein Nielsen pointed out) that is likely because I am measuring the
>quality of all Duck drawings based on my having been introduced to the
>Ducks by seeing Carl Barks' Ducks.
Could well be right. In the early 1960, Strobl was a regular guest in the Dutch
Donald weekly and I still like him (see below).
>I do Not like the Ducks of Carol, Romano Scarpa, post 1958 (1959 and later)
>Tony Strobl work, most of the Italian artists, McSavage, Harry Balm, Danny
>Wanner, Jules Coenen (sometimes), Marc de Jonge, most of the other Western
>Publishing artists, Don Rosa, Paul Murray,many of the Hachette artists,
>many of the Egmont Spanish artists....etc.
>
>Eddy van Schuylenburg, Vicar, Jules Coenen (at his best), Michel Nadorp,
>Endre Lucasz, Carpi, Cavazzano (at his best)
>(....)
>It is a matter of style chosen by the artist, and individual taste of the
>fan.
You are quite right, of course: it's a matter of taste. Hoewever, I want to put
one thing straight. There are two standards to judge Disney art c.q. Duck art
by: is it technically correct? Are the Ducks "cute"? It's clear that you are on
the technical side. This can be seen from your choices: Barks, old Strobl,
and _not_ the Italian artists, not even Scarpa.
I'm on the cute side; so I do like most of the famous Italians,
everything
of Strobl. Of course I'm not exactly a Barks hater <g>, but I read his
stories to read the stories, if you know what I mean. Enjoying nice, charming
art is a different thing. To everyone, his specialism. Voges is one of the cute
Duck artists, and I love his stories for it. (Not as stories indeed,
they're full
of cliches.)
>As you can tell from these lists, my views (....) come from personal taste,
>and do not relate exactly to technical competence of the artist.
As you've read, I do not completely agree with that. I think they do; but
chances are that it's not exactly competence that counts, but the artist's
goal, or specialization.
At 14 Jan 2001 11:37:45, Frank Stajano wrote:
>At 2001-01-13 20:20 +0100, Henri Kunne wrote:
> > Other Dutch list members here with any expressed opinion about
> >Voges' Disney art?
>
>Obvious follow-up: why not putting up a few scans somewhere so that we can
>all form first-hand opinions?
Very good excuse: because I haven't got a scanner at the moment.
At Mon, 15 Jan 2001 10:19:47, Harry Fluks wrote:
>Henri:
> > I consider Voges' Duck art even very good. We
> > already talked about
> > this, Harry, but I want other list members to know about my
> > "second opinion",
> > so they won't take yours for a scientific fact.
>
>Of course my opinion is not a scientific fact. I'm not sure why you think
>anyone would think it is.
Well, maybe I should have put a smiley behind that one. Or said: take
your words for granted. I know nobody will think of science. I cannot see
why you think that I think that they think.... ;-)
>I'm not surprised you like Voges' work. For every artist there is or has
>been at least one fan who says his/her work is very good. My most favourite
>artists to dislike are Perego, Lockman, and Voges. And now I know that all
>three of them have a bunch of true fans too. 8-)
Well, at least we agree about Perego. I'm not exactly fond, either, of his
"rush hour work" in the bean string stories in the very old LTB's.
Greetings, Henri