Kriton:
> > I made a new wesite, about 50 years of Dutch "Donald Duck"
> > weekly. The URL is:
> > http://members.tripod.lycos.nl/bolderbast/xindexeng.html
> > The website is, like this invitation, bi-lingual.
>
> Isn't this redundant? I would assume that readers of the Dutch weekly
> are able to read Dutch, thus not requiring an English version
> of the site!
I assume that it is interesting for non-Dutch people too. I'm writing the
texts with in my mind that I would like to see similar things for foreign
Disney comics myself.
(In other words: the site is also meant for *you*.)
> > http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/add.php
> >
> > There you can index comics
>
> This looks like the program I had once suggested writing, for those
> like me who find the database format daunting. Back then, the reaction
> I got was that the format was simplicity itself, and that
> such a program would be unnecessary.
I still think that the website (program) is only useful for people who do an
occasional index. People who index a LOT have better tools for doing that.
> (I even got a confusing explanation of the format,
> to which someone replied with an even more confusing answer,
> describing
> various advanced tricks and obscure points.)
Of course, if you don't explain *what* is confusing to you, we can't make
our explanations better. I don't remember exactly how my confusing
explanation looked like, but if you have a look at the webpage:
http://home.wxs.nl/~fluks4/bolderbast/xf0short.html
can you tell me what it is that confuses you so much?
(Back then, I probably should have told you to ignore the "advanced tricks
and obscure points" that others posted.)
--Harry.
Author
Topic: 200109
(277 messages)
Fluks, H.W.
Indexing
Message 46 -
2001-09-06 at 17:05:55
Ari Seppi
Goofy and Fethry and Donald and Mickey
Message 47 -
2001-09-06 at 20:27:20
Theresa:
>I certainly agree!!! Goofy has a great deal of personality! But that is
>something that Mickey lacks, in my opinion (personality). I've read a lot
>of mickey stories in my days, and I've never liked them at all as much
>Donald-stories, because of Mickey's lack of personality.
The thing I like about Goofy is that he makes good Scifi/Fantasy -stories
possible. For some reason those stories don't usually work with ducks. For
example the Ice Sword series *) and the Star Wars parody *2). Plain wonderful.
*) http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1411-B
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1464-B
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1517-A
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1936-A
*2)
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/comp2.php?lg=0&default_o=1&ser=Lords+Galaxy
--
Ari Seppi (mani at iki.fi)
http://www.iki.fi/mani/
Eritt?in fanaattinen Harry Potter -kirjojen ja Disney-sarjakuvien palvoja
>I certainly agree!!! Goofy has a great deal of personality! But that is
>something that Mickey lacks, in my opinion (personality). I've read a lot
>of mickey stories in my days, and I've never liked them at all as much
>Donald-stories, because of Mickey's lack of personality.
The thing I like about Goofy is that he makes good Scifi/Fantasy -stories
possible. For some reason those stories don't usually work with ducks. For
example the Ice Sword series *) and the Star Wars parody *2). Plain wonderful.
*) http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1411-B
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1464-B
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1517-A
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1936-A
*2)
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/comp2.php?lg=0&default_o=1&ser=Lords+Galaxy
--
Ari Seppi (mani at iki.fi)
http://www.iki.fi/mani/
Eritt?in fanaattinen Harry Potter -kirjojen ja Disney-sarjakuvien palvoja
Wes Andersen
First day of school
Message 48 -
2001-09-06 at 20:40:27
Last night I pulled open my box of old comics to read a Carl Barks 10 pager
to my two kids. It didn't have a title on it, but it was about HD&L rafting
down a river instead of attending the first day of school, and Donald's
attempt to thwart their truancy. What a happy coincidence that it was also
my daughter's first week of school -- first grade. It made the story seem
seasonally timely -- a rare event since comics aren't published in the U.S.
these days.
Anyone have any favorite HD&L school oriented stories (and the US issues
they appear in) that I can read to my kids this week?
-- Wes
---------------------------------------------
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The most fun you will ever have on a computer!
http://buddy.play.net/gs3?gladdstone
_________________________________________________________________
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to my two kids. It didn't have a title on it, but it was about HD&L rafting
down a river instead of attending the first day of school, and Donald's
attempt to thwart their truancy. What a happy coincidence that it was also
my daughter's first week of school -- first grade. It made the story seem
seasonally timely -- a rare event since comics aren't published in the U.S.
these days.
Anyone have any favorite HD&L school oriented stories (and the US issues
they appear in) that I can read to my kids this week?
-- Wes
---------------------------------------------
GemStone III: Try it for free!
The most fun you will ever have on a computer!
http://buddy.play.net/gs3?gladdstone
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp
Olivier
First Day of School
Message 49 -
2001-09-06 at 21:18:32
Hi Wes and everyone!
HDL & (not going to) school:
WDC&S 72 (Sept '46) ("Playing Hookey", album 9)
WDC&S 100 (Jan '49 ) ("Truant Officer Donald", album 14)
And my favorite:
WDC&S 133 (Oct '51) ("The Truant Nephews", album 19)
as well as the one you've read,
WDC&S 169 (Oct '54) ("Travelling Truants", album 26)
Have a nice week reading these stories and others!
Olivier
HDL & (not going to) school:
WDC&S 72 (Sept '46) ("Playing Hookey", album 9)
WDC&S 100 (Jan '49 ) ("Truant Officer Donald", album 14)
And my favorite:
WDC&S 133 (Oct '51) ("The Truant Nephews", album 19)
as well as the one you've read,
WDC&S 169 (Oct '54) ("Travelling Truants", album 26)
Have a nice week reading these stories and others!
Olivier
Anders Christian Sivebaek
Covers
Message 50 -
2001-09-06 at 22:27:23
Hi
This week a new era starts! The danish weekly strated to use covers
which illustrate a story inside.
The first one is just a gag about fishing, but Donald is fishing in a
Marco Rota-story inside.
Next week Scrooge is playing golf against Glomgold, both on the cover
and in the Vicar-story inside.
Usually the covers for the weekly and for many US and WDC-issues have
been gag-covers, and I for one don't like them as much as this other
kind of cover.
Barks for instance made both kinds. For the late WDC and US-issue he
made many covers illustrating a story inside.
My second favorite Don Rosa does this too, makes covers illustrating
stories, (even cover illustrating stories, meaning one cover for eg.
that Donald & Scrooge-book showing things from all stories inside).
What I find special about Barks' and especially Don's covers, is that
they do illustrate the story inside, but you usually can't find the
exact same scene in the story - the cover is sort of putting together
the essence of the story, maybe catching your eye with a funny
situation (faithfull readers will nodd their heads here and think of
the Columbus-cover or the one for the new Money Bin vs. Beagle Boys
cover.)
That was what I wanted to say - if possible, could any of you who are
artists tell me what to call these things, other than covers
illustrating a/the story inside the comic??
A. C. Sivebaek
acsive at mail.mira.dk
This week a new era starts! The danish weekly strated to use covers
which illustrate a story inside.
The first one is just a gag about fishing, but Donald is fishing in a
Marco Rota-story inside.
Next week Scrooge is playing golf against Glomgold, both on the cover
and in the Vicar-story inside.
Usually the covers for the weekly and for many US and WDC-issues have
been gag-covers, and I for one don't like them as much as this other
kind of cover.
Barks for instance made both kinds. For the late WDC and US-issue he
made many covers illustrating a story inside.
My second favorite Don Rosa does this too, makes covers illustrating
stories, (even cover illustrating stories, meaning one cover for eg.
that Donald & Scrooge-book showing things from all stories inside).
What I find special about Barks' and especially Don's covers, is that
they do illustrate the story inside, but you usually can't find the
exact same scene in the story - the cover is sort of putting together
the essence of the story, maybe catching your eye with a funny
situation (faithfull readers will nodd their heads here and think of
the Columbus-cover or the one for the new Money Bin vs. Beagle Boys
cover.)
That was what I wanted to say - if possible, could any of you who are
artists tell me what to call these things, other than covers
illustrating a/the story inside the comic??
A. C. Sivebaek
acsive at mail.mira.dk
Shaun Craill
Dan Shane's Money Bin Plans
Message 51 -
2001-09-07 at 02:02:46
Hi everyone,
It was mentioned that Dan Shane was going to fix up some mistakes in the
money bin plans. I hope that this doesn't mean that the 'secret
compartment' gets removed, even if it was just a mistake Dan made in the
blue prints. I kind of liked the idea that the architect made a goof and
left a sealed off section nobody knows about. Could make a good story idea!
Maybe part of the lost library is sealed in there...
Best regards
Shaun Craill
It was mentioned that Dan Shane was going to fix up some mistakes in the
money bin plans. I hope that this doesn't mean that the 'secret
compartment' gets removed, even if it was just a mistake Dan made in the
blue prints. I kind of liked the idea that the architect made a goof and
left a sealed off section nobody knows about. Could make a good story idea!
Maybe part of the lost library is sealed in there...
Best regards
Shaun Craill
Ari Seppi
Goofy and Fethry and Donald and Mickey
Message 52 -
2001-09-07 at 10:06:19
[Apparently the first message didn't end up to the list: new try. Hopefully
you won't get dublicates.]
Theresa:
>I certainly agree!!! Goofy has a great deal of personality! But that is
>something that Mickey lacks, in my opinion (personality). I've read a lot
>of mickey stories in my days, and I've never liked them at all as much
>Donald-stories, because of Mickey's lack of personality.
The thing I like about Goofy is that he makes good Scifi/Fantasy -stories
possible. For some reason those stories don't usually work with ducks. For
example the Ice Sword series *) and the Star Wars parody *2). Plain wonderful.
*) http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1411-B
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1464-B
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1517-A
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1936-A
*2)
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/comp2.php?lg=0&default_o=1&ser=Lords+Galaxy
--
Ari Seppi (mani at iki.fi)
http://www.iki.fi/mani/
Eritt?in fanaattinen Harry Potter -kirjojen ja Disney-sarjakuvien palvoja
you won't get dublicates.]
Theresa:
>I certainly agree!!! Goofy has a great deal of personality! But that is
>something that Mickey lacks, in my opinion (personality). I've read a lot
>of mickey stories in my days, and I've never liked them at all as much
>Donald-stories, because of Mickey's lack of personality.
The thing I like about Goofy is that he makes good Scifi/Fantasy -stories
possible. For some reason those stories don't usually work with ducks. For
example the Ice Sword series *) and the Star Wars parody *2). Plain wonderful.
*) http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1411-B
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1464-B
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1517-A
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1936-A
*2)
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/comp2.php?lg=0&default_o=1&ser=Lords+Galaxy
--
Ari Seppi (mani at iki.fi)
http://www.iki.fi/mani/
Eritt?in fanaattinen Harry Potter -kirjojen ja Disney-sarjakuvien palvoja
Olaf Solstrand AOL
Andebyonline.com aviable from today at noon (Norwegian time)
Message 53 -
2001-09-07 at 10:51:49
Hi! Today, September 7th at 12:00 Norwegian time, I'm gonna publish my new
Duckburgian website. It's in Norwegian, but for those of you that are
interested, the address is
www.andebyonline.com
Lots of things missing. But hey, at least it's there.
-olaf-
Duckburgian website. It's in Norwegian, but for those of you that are
interested, the address is
www.andebyonline.com
Lots of things missing. But hey, at least it's there.
-olaf-
Olaf Solstrand
Andeby Online is online!!!
Message 54 -
2001-09-07 at 13:23:41
Finally, my Andeby (=Duckburg) homepage is finished!
You can find it at
- - - - - - - - - - -
www.andebyonline.com
- - - - - - - - - - -
It's not bilingual yet, only in Norwegian... but I hope you all know enough
Norwegian to understand it! :)
And I hope you don't think of this "advertising" as "illegal"? Is it?
According to what I've seen on the list before, I don't think so...
Btw; I worked with this site all night (went to bed at 7 am), so I may have
forgotten a few sources. If you find something missing, please mail me about
it.
ZoLong!
-olaf- andebyonline.com
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp
You can find it at
- - - - - - - - - - -
www.andebyonline.com
- - - - - - - - - - -
It's not bilingual yet, only in Norwegian... but I hope you all know enough
Norwegian to understand it! :)
And I hope you don't think of this "advertising" as "illegal"? Is it?
According to what I've seen on the list before, I don't think so...
Btw; I worked with this site all night (went to bed at 7 am), so I may have
forgotten a few sources. If you find something missing, please mail me about
it.
ZoLong!
-olaf- andebyonline.com
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp
Olaf Solstrand
DCML digest, Vol 1 #658 - 11 msgs
Message 55 -
2001-09-07 at 13:26:38
>When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>than "Re: Contents of DCML digest..."
>
>
>Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: DCML digest, Vol 1 #657 - 14 msgs (Kriton Kyrimis)
> 2. RE: DCML digest, Vol 1 #657 - 14 msgs (Francois Willot)
> 3. Re: DCML digest, Vol 1 #657 - 14 msgs (Alecto)
...
Hmm...
just a thought.. Ok. Bye.
-olaf- andebyonline.com
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp
>than "Re: Contents of DCML digest..."
>
>
>Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: DCML digest, Vol 1 #657 - 14 msgs (Kriton Kyrimis)
> 2. RE: DCML digest, Vol 1 #657 - 14 msgs (Francois Willot)
> 3. Re: DCML digest, Vol 1 #657 - 14 msgs (Alecto)
...
Hmm...
just a thought.. Ok. Bye.
-olaf- andebyonline.com
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp
Timo Ronkainen
Dutch DD-book history page
Message 56 -
2001-09-07 at 13:42:23
> > Isn't this redundant? I assume that it is interesting for non-Dutch
>people too.
And so it is! Thanks for making it in english too, Harry! Very interesting
reading!
Timo
^^''*''^^
Cartoonist - writer - donaldist -
Timo Ronkainen ---------------- -
YO-kylä 52 A 26 --------------- -
20540 Turku ------------------- -
Finland ----------------------- -
timoro at hotmail.com
timoro at sunpoint.net
¨¨ Personal:
http://www.geocities.com/timoro2/
¨¨ Ankkalinnan Pamaus:
http://welcome.to/ankistit
.................................
"Rumble on, buxom bumble bee!
Go sit on cowslip - far from me!"
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp
>people too.
And so it is! Thanks for making it in english too, Harry! Very interesting
reading!
Timo
^^''*''^^
Cartoonist - writer - donaldist -
Timo Ronkainen ---------------- -
YO-kylä 52 A 26 --------------- -
20540 Turku ------------------- -
Finland ----------------------- -
timoro at hotmail.com
timoro at sunpoint.net
¨¨ Personal:
http://www.geocities.com/timoro2/
¨¨ Ankkalinnan Pamaus:
http://welcome.to/ankistit
.................................
"Rumble on, buxom bumble bee!
Go sit on cowslip - far from me!"
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp
Kevin Howard
Nationalities here on DCML
Message 57 -
2001-09-07 at 14:00:22
>> I think there are quite a lot of Dutch people here (I've seen
>> at least 5).
>> Especially compared to the population of Netherlands.
>
>Well, the Dutch population is not *that* small (16 million people). >Bigger
than any Scandinavian country, while the number of people >from Scandinavian
countries is quite large here...
But there are more French or Germans in the world than Dutch, while the
number of persons on DCML is more or less the same.
So in fact, Dutch are not "rare" here. French and German are rare, just like
many other nationalities.
Dutch are on the 5 or 7 most represented nations, with Scandinavia, Finland
and Italy/USA.
Kevy.
_______________________________________________________
http://inbox.excite.com
>> at least 5).
>> Especially compared to the population of Netherlands.
>
>Well, the Dutch population is not *that* small (16 million people). >Bigger
than any Scandinavian country, while the number of people >from Scandinavian
countries is quite large here...
But there are more French or Germans in the world than Dutch, while the
number of persons on DCML is more or less the same.
So in fact, Dutch are not "rare" here. French and German are rare, just like
many other nationalities.
Dutch are on the 5 or 7 most represented nations, with Scandinavia, Finland
and Italy/USA.
Kevy.
_______________________________________________________
http://inbox.excite.com
Jan Follak
Website about the Dutch DD-Weekly
Message 58 -
2001-09-07 at 14:04:45
Harry:
Although your website isn't finished yet, I enjoyed reading and looking at
what is already there very much. One things is especially interesting: the
German "Micky Maus" celebrates its own fifties-anniversary this year and
its development can (sometimes) be compared to the Dutch weekly. Too bad
that we did not have the renaissance in the seventies. Instead the German
weekly was almost as dull as in the sixties. On the other hand I agree with
you about the S-coded-stories that started to appear in the sixties. I grew
up with them and found many of them very good and funny.
Best wishes,
Jan
Although your website isn't finished yet, I enjoyed reading and looking at
what is already there very much. One things is especially interesting: the
German "Micky Maus" celebrates its own fifties-anniversary this year and
its development can (sometimes) be compared to the Dutch weekly. Too bad
that we did not have the renaissance in the seventies. Instead the German
weekly was almost as dull as in the sixties. On the other hand I agree with
you about the S-coded-stories that started to appear in the sixties. I grew
up with them and found many of them very good and funny.
Best wishes,
Jan
Ari Seppi
Goofy and Fethry and Donald and Mickey
Message 59 -
2001-09-07 at 15:16:26
Theresa:
>I certainly agree!!! Goofy has a great deal of personality! But that is
>something that Mickey lacks, in my opinion (personality). I've read a lot
>of mickey stories in my days, and I've never liked them at all as much
>Donald-stories, because of Mickey's lack of personality.
The thing I like about Goofy is that he makes good Scifi/Fantasy -stories
possible. For some reason those stories don't usually work with ducks. For
example the Ice Sword series *) and the Star Wars parody *2). Plain wonderful.
*) http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1411-B
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1464-B
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1517-A
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1936-A
*2)
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/comp2.php?lg=0&default_o=1&ser=Lords+Galaxy
--
Ari Seppi (mani at iki.fi)
http://www.iki.fi/mani/
Eritt?in fanaattinen Harry Potter -kirjojen ja Disney-sarjakuvien palvoja
>I certainly agree!!! Goofy has a great deal of personality! But that is
>something that Mickey lacks, in my opinion (personality). I've read a lot
>of mickey stories in my days, and I've never liked them at all as much
>Donald-stories, because of Mickey's lack of personality.
The thing I like about Goofy is that he makes good Scifi/Fantasy -stories
possible. For some reason those stories don't usually work with ducks. For
example the Ice Sword series *) and the Star Wars parody *2). Plain wonderful.
*) http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1411-B
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1464-B
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1517-A
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/story.php/0/I+TL+1936-A
*2)
http://www2.ec-lille.fr/willot/coa/c1/comp2.php?lg=0&default_o=1&ser=Lords+Galaxy
--
Ari Seppi (mani at iki.fi)
http://www.iki.fi/mani/
Eritt?in fanaattinen Harry Potter -kirjojen ja Disney-sarjakuvien palvoja
Dan Shane
Dan Shane's Money Bin Plans
Message 60 -
2001-09-07 at 15:39:02
SHAUN CRAILL WROTE:
> It was mentioned that Dan Shane was going to fix up some mistakes in the
> money bin plans. I hope that this doesn't mean that the 'secret
> compartment' gets removed, even if it was just a mistake Dan made in the
> blue prints. I kind of liked the idea that the architect made a goof and
> left a sealed off section nobody knows about. Could make a good story
idea!
> Maybe part of the lost library is sealed in there...
AND I REPLY:
DOH!
Why didn't you remind me of that earlier? Now that dumb mistake lives on in
the newest incarnation of the plans. Our only hope now is that Don does
indeed someday use the "secret compartment" idea and vindicates my
stupidity.
And in case anyone out there thinks this sort of thing doesn't happen in
real life, I'll provide genuine proof that it does. When I was receiving my
architectural training at Louisville Technical Institute (well, it beats
truck driving school), our class took a field trip to a subdivision being
developed.
One house among many we toured was just having its main floor laid over the
basement area. The designer made a mistake on his plans and provided a
dimension that said the floor was so many feet long. He was off by about 6
feet, and the construction worker took him at his word. We stared in
amazement at a floor that stopped in mid air with an 8 foot drop off below.
Maybe the builder thought a staircase or ladder was going to be placed there
someday? Or a sliding board into a money bin?
Anyway, the contractor was obviously going to have to fix it, but it was fun
to think of all the work the poor fellow put into that perfectly squared off
platform, only to have to do it over.
I could easily see that same young man enclosing a space under the stairs
just because my drawing told him to. He would never say anything to anyone
else about it, and the contractor might never wonder what is behind that
wall.
> It was mentioned that Dan Shane was going to fix up some mistakes in the
> money bin plans. I hope that this doesn't mean that the 'secret
> compartment' gets removed, even if it was just a mistake Dan made in the
> blue prints. I kind of liked the idea that the architect made a goof and
> left a sealed off section nobody knows about. Could make a good story
idea!
> Maybe part of the lost library is sealed in there...
AND I REPLY:
DOH!
Why didn't you remind me of that earlier? Now that dumb mistake lives on in
the newest incarnation of the plans. Our only hope now is that Don does
indeed someday use the "secret compartment" idea and vindicates my
stupidity.
And in case anyone out there thinks this sort of thing doesn't happen in
real life, I'll provide genuine proof that it does. When I was receiving my
architectural training at Louisville Technical Institute (well, it beats
truck driving school), our class took a field trip to a subdivision being
developed.
One house among many we toured was just having its main floor laid over the
basement area. The designer made a mistake on his plans and provided a
dimension that said the floor was so many feet long. He was off by about 6
feet, and the construction worker took him at his word. We stared in
amazement at a floor that stopped in mid air with an 8 foot drop off below.
Maybe the builder thought a staircase or ladder was going to be placed there
someday? Or a sliding board into a money bin?
Anyway, the contractor was obviously going to have to fix it, but it was fun
to think of all the work the poor fellow put into that perfectly squared off
platform, only to have to do it over.
I could easily see that same young man enclosing a space under the stairs
just because my drawing told him to. He would never say anything to anyone
else about it, and the contractor might never wonder what is behind that
wall.