Keskustelujen arkisto

Don Rosa:

> If a publisher or translator, or if any readers change or
> interpret my story as having $crooge live anywhere other than the west
> coast of the USA, then they are *dead wrong*. As regards my
> story. They are
> free to have their own interpretation, but NOT as regards MY
> story.

and:

> My Duckburg is in
> 1950's America and any editor or reader who changes or
> misunderstands that is making an error.
> And if a reader doesn't like that, they should avoid
> reading my stories since I don't wish to make anyone unhappy.

I am not avoiding to read your stories, since *that* would make me
unhappy...
I do like your stories, but I also expect the editors to adapt your stories
to local tradition. (Money should be yellow, for instance.)
The problem is, that they are *Disney* stories. This means they should fit
in the Disney universe of the country where they are published.
So when you say that editors make an error when doing their work according
to Disney's rules, that does sound a bit arrogant.

I think, with the way the Disney world currently works, you'll have to
accept that YOUR stories are not YOUR stories anymore, the moment you
deliver them to the publisher.
Also, the fact that they are Disney stories is part of their success. (Note
that in Holland, Disney comics are the *only* American comics for children,
that have been successful since 1952.)

--Harry.

From: Tommi Perkola <matope at uta.fi>
>>>There simply are such things alive as
traditions, and euroducks where Duckburg hasn't any clear situation on
the map, and where Scrooge is Grandma's brother,

You know, I'm really unclear as to what your point is. Are you saying that
you think I should change MY stories to reflect these errors? Or are you
just explaining why you don't like the way I do it (which is fine)? Grandma
was *never* supposed to be $crooge's sister in the original version, and
Duckburg was never supposed to be a fairytale town that exists in a
fantasyland dimension, (and the coins in the Money Bin were never supposed
to all be solid gold). These are European creations and/or errors. And I am
willing to accept that these inaccuracies are now traditions and I would
never campaign that all other writers and artists should change their
minds, even if I thought I could. But are you suggesting that *I* should
change *my* interpretation to reflect these inaccuracies? Why on earth
should I or would I do that?! It would be an insult to the whole reason I'm
doing this, which is to honor the Barks stories I grew up on, not because
his stories have been carried off into many different, some good and some
bad, directions by writers and artists he never knew.

>>>>>Disney comics practically lived the passage between Barks and Rosa in
that tradition, and some of us grew with it. And by the way, there are
some good stories and artwork in it. Pays off to check out!

You don't seem to get it. Dan can't do that. I can't do that. Those stories
are not and have never been available to us even if we could read all the
different languages involved. And when a miniscule fraction of those
stories were translated by Gladstone, the European "inaccuracies" were
corrected. These "European traditions" were obliterated as they should have
been for our eyes, and the original versions replaced.

From: "Fluks, H.W." <H.W.Fluks at kpn.com>
>>>>Still, the Dutch tradition is that Duckburg (Duckstad) is nearby. Where
they
have our currency, and our language. Where people live in the present. They
don't let any Rosa change that tradition. So I expect to see the euro sign
in Scrooge's bin in the next Rosa story.

Oh, right, so do I. I just wanted to publicly guarantee people, if they
didn't already know it, that if they ever do see a Euro symbol on the Money
Bin in one of my stories, that it was done only because I can't prevent it
and that it was certainly not from my original script or art.

From: Kari Lepola <Kari.Lepola at hut.fi>
>>>Well, this isn't really a problem in Finland anyway, because the symbol
on the money bin has (at least as far as I know) always been RA meaning
Roope Ankka, which is Scrooge's name in finish.

Oh, yes, drat! I knew that!!! I've even put the "RA" on the "Attaaaaack!"
cover I drew especially for AKU ANKKA! Why did I mention Finland in that
reference? Sorry!

On Tue, 15 Jan 2002, Don Rosa wrote:

> You don't seem to get it. Dan can't do that. I can't do that. Those stories
> are not and have never been available to us even if we could read all the
> different languages involved. And when a miniscule fraction of those
> stories were translated by Gladstone, the European "inaccuracies" were
> corrected. These "European traditions" were obliterated as they should have
> been for our eyes, and the original versions replaced.

<delurk>
Uhm... so... Gladstone changed the european stories to make them fit
with current traditions, to make them more easily accepted by american
readers.

How is this different than european publishers changing american stories
to make them with fit current traditions, to make them more easily
accepted by european readers?

PS. I love your stories Don, and frankly I don't care where Scrooge
lives, as long as it fits the story. :)
</delurk>

--
Morten
Windows Closed. You can't look outside now.

Hi all and happy new year

[I was off-line for more than a month...]

Nice topic we have! Scrooge's home and Euro...

Well, in my duckworld Scrooge lives
in the United States of America. But if some artists
prefer to put the ducks in their countries, insteed of
USA, that's ok. I don't care so much about that. I
love both American and European stories.

As for Euro: In Greece, Duckburg is situated in
Calisota, USA. And Scrooge is using dollars insteed of
Drachmas (greek currency, which after 2000 years of
history will be lost, since it's Europe's oldest
currency) or Euros. So no problem here. As for the
sign of the Money Bin, in Greece the editors put
dollar's mark [$].

Some interesting info:
1) The words Euro (and Europe) are greek (as you may
already know). "Europe" is related to the greek
mythology. I don't remember the story very well but I
think she's a godness. In the back view of the Greek
2-euro coin, Europe is being kidnapped (again, I don't
remember the story, sorry).
2) Denmark will soon get to the Eurozone (next year).
Anders, I'll send you a few coins to prepare yourself
:-)
3) The Euro-sign {?) is also greek (from the greek
letter å) :-)

Best Wishes

=====
Apostolis Trikourakis, Athens, Greece
E-mail: komixgreekpage at yahoo.com
Web Site: http://www.geocities.com/komixgreekpage

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-----Original Message-----
From: "Fabio Blanco" <longtom at oeste.com.ar>

> Yep, in the first times of Abril's Pato Donald, Scrooge was "Tio Patilludo".
> Patilludo is somebody with a lot of fur (or feathers) in the side of the
> face... like Elvis Presley, you know... I cant remember the word for this,
> but I always think that patinhas was that.

In English, the word is 'sideburns'

--

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Martin S. Thoresen:

> Don Rosa, and [Harry] Fluks seemed to suggest that the whole yellow coin
> thing is a European tradition, to accomodate local currency.

No, not to accomodate local currency. I think it's more a graphical matter.
Yellow coins simply "look better" in a comic drawing. Or at least they did
in the 1940s, when this tradition started.

Before the euro came, our local coins were silver (and the smallest were
brown).

> I can also never remember to have seen a picture of the money
> bin with any other colour either

A well-known example of brown/grey money in a Disney comic is in Rosa's Life
of Scrooge, chapter 12.
This looked very strange to me, in the Dutch version.

> The question you say? Oh, yes, what kind of color are the
> coins suppoused to have,

Yellow, IMO. Because it looks nice, and I'm used to it (the European
tradition).

> and why are they sometimes(?) yellow?

Because that's the colour they are supposed to have. 8-)

--Harry.

HARRY:

> You could also call it revenge. Walt Disney and his people did it all the
> time: take European tales or literary pieces, and change them to their
> liking for a movie.

Hear! Hear!

> Should I take that serously? Do Scandinavians consider themselves
> non-Europeans?

Well, they do tend to speak American English better than Americans...

:-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-)

> That might be the reason that Finland is the only Nordic country sensible
**************
I think you've answered your own question. (My guess is that Scandinavia,
like Greece, not being close to the core European countries, is both
European and something else, the same way that Greece is both a European
and a Balkan country.)

> For people unfamiliar with European currency: the euro is divided into 100
> cents. The word "cent" is new to, for instance, Finnish euro users.

So, how many cents (US) in a cent (EURO)?

In Greece, we actually call cents "lepta", which is the name we used to
have for the 1/100th of a drachma, back when the drachma was valuable
enough that it made sense for it to have subdivisions. We even go so far
as to write this on the national side of Greek Euro coins. I think that
this is pushing the limits of what we are allowed to do on the national
side of Euro coins, but it does give us a sense of continuity.

ARI:

> This reminded me of the question that disturbed my thinking in
> "Where Scrooge lives" discussion, which might have made my
> messages a bit confusing to read. A philosophical question:
> who or what decides what are right answers to these questions?

Given the intensity of the arguments that we've had, I think that the
answer is: "the readers". Barks took something made by Disney and turned
it into something much bigger, then other artists took that and turned
it into something even bigger (and occasionally better). If readers tend
to set apart stories by Don, set in the US, by Scarpa, set in a kind of
US that, according to an old Gladstone article, looks more like Italy,
and by other artists, set wherever they decided to place them, then this
is where Scrooge lives.

MARTIN:

> As a kid I always thought that they
> were yellow
> because US money were yellow (Until I actually saw a Dollar, then I just
> thought
> it was some kind of international colouring thing).

I remember reading a story where Scrooge had gone color blind and could
not tell red 100-dollar bills from green 1-dollar bills! Until I saw
dollar bills of various denominations, which are all green, I thought
that they came in different colors according to their denomination!

APOSTOLIS:

> In Greece, Duckburg is situated in
> Calisota, USA. And Scrooge is using dollars insteed of
> Drachmas

But the dollar is divided into what is translated as 100 "dekares"
(a "dekara" is a 0.10 drachma coin), and Scrooge's dime is also his
"dekara", causing a bit of confusion if one tries to figure out what a
"dekara" is in the context of Disney comics.

Adding to the confusion, when I was little, cents were left untranslated
as "sents", and in MIKY MAOYS #1 Mickey pays his restaurant bill in
drachmas!

> (greek currency, which after 2000 years of
> history

Though not continuous use.

> 1) The words Euro (and Europe) are greek (as you may
> already know). "Europe" is related to the greek
> mythology. I don't remember the story very well but I
> think she's a godness.

Nope, just one of the girls from whom Zeus couldn't keep his hands off.
(See, e.g., http://www.dilos.com/region/crete/europa.html)

> 2) Denmark will soon get to the Eurozone (next year).

I was under the impression that they are only likely to do so, after
holding a referendum next year.

> 3) The Euro-sign is also greek (from the greek letter epsilon) :-)

[I modified the above text, as it wasn't completely readable.]

The Euro sign is supposed to be the Greek letter epsilon, with an
additional horizontal line, denoting the stability of the currency.
This, however, is more of a non-Greek's view of how the letter epsilon
is drawn; I doubt whether there are many Greeks who write epsilon
as a semi-circle with a horizontal line in the middle. (Check out
http://dias.cti.gr/~kyrimis/pics/epsilon.gif to compare the Euro sign
with the letter epsilon.)

Kriton (e-mail: kyrimis at cti.gr)
(WWW: http://dias.cti.gr/~kyrimis)
-----
"Kings and Emperors aren't supposed to have common sense. It's too common."
-----

From: Kriton Kyrimis <kyrimis at cti.gr>

> like "the magic recorder". After trying various translations of the Greek
> title, I ended up going through the entire list of Gatto's stories, ending
> up with "il piffero ladroincantadore", a phrase which I can attempt to
> translate as "the thief-enchanting flute", but with which I would never
> have come up myself, even if I had been given this translation!

That's my favourite Gatto's story! :-)

--
Sprea