Keskustelujen arkisto

Although Gilles is correct that it would be more difficult to make a family
tree for Mickey mouse than for Donald Duck, -it would be very interesting to
see. Gottfredson gave us the Fieldmouses (not Fieldmice!) and Churchmouses (not
Churchmice) (just as the Native American U.S.A. and Canadian Blackfeet tribal
members are not a Blackfoot in the singular), as well as several other Mouses.
But, I believe Paul Murray's stories (writers) gave us even more of Mickey's
relatives. He visited many, many over the years in the Mickey Mouse serials in
WDC & S, and also in Mickey Mouse comics (from the early 1950s through the mid
1970s. I don't remember very many Mouse relatives in Mouse stories drawn by
Bill Wright, Dick Moores, or any other of the less prolific artists, but there
must have been at least a few. Perhaps Noel van Horn has introduced some? It
would be nice if someone on DCML (with a lot of free time) could search through
all the Mickey strips and comics and compile a list of all those relatives. If
the Hoozoo list or the other Disney character lists are complete (for Mouse
characters of even single panel appearances), then it is only a matter of
figuring out how they are related to Mickey and each other. I hope someone
attempts it (or, has it already been done?)

Rob
Klein

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Hey Gilles,

>D 2000-022 : "Les Revenants de 'l'Ent?t?"
>
>In this story, Mouseton celebrates its bicentennial, and shows
>in a museum the steamboat from "Steamboat Willie".
>And this boat is haunted by the black and white Mickey from the
>cartoon "steamboat willie", and is in fact called "Mikiki", and
>he is the comics' Mickey's great-great-uncle.
Heh! This story is "Steamboat Willies" by Stefan Petrucha and Cesar
Ferioli. I edited it, and consider it among the best work of both creators.
Aside from the coolness of the basic idea, Stefan created a pretty
realistic backstory for his ghost saga, full of meaningful emotion; not easy
to do in just ten pages. Cesar meanwhile produced a great simulation of
early Gottfredson style in his renderings of 1902 Mouseton.

David

Erik wrote:

>Then be surprised.

I certainly am... :-) Thanks for that, and yes, hopefully someone can tell
us more about these interesting Austrian giveaways I've never heard about.

Frank

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Thanks, Olivier and Luca (in private mail). So now I know that I better read
all of Luca's articles first, before I annoy the dcml with questions that
already had "official" answers. ;-)

However, both of you weren't sure about this question:

>>>Did the teaming happen accidentally, i.e. Gottfredson wasn't allowed to
>>>use Donald anymore (as in
>>>Editor-In-Grief and others), because DD got his own strip?

Of course, as Luca told me, MM and GO had already been teamed together as
early as 'The Crazy Crime Wave' (1933), but my theory is that DD would have
been included in that story, if he had been created by then. Later on he of
course appeared in four (?) Gottfredson episodes, and the debate is still
open if Gottfredson & Co. weren't supposed to use Donald anymore or if they
didn't WANT to use him anymore, because they had already fallen in love with
the MM/GO duo.

Frank

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Re the proposed "live-action" Duck movie... I can't resist....

"Sean Connery IS Scrooge McDuck!"

Now, if we can only get him to accept a "pro bono" gig... :-)

Chris Barat

Erik wrote:

> My remberance on this item may be foggy, but I always
> thought after 1933 there were no MM strips in regular German newspapers.

Oh, you bear your age quite well, Erik. ;-)

I think I have read something about "K?lner Stadt-Anzeiger" in this
regard. Wouldn't swear to it, however.

Gerd

Hi everyone!

Frank:
>>> Of course, as Luca told me, MM and GO had already been teamed together as
>>> early as 'The Crazy Crime Wave' (1933), but my theory is that DD would have
>>> been included in that story, if he had been created by then. Later on he of
>>> course appeared in four (?) Gottfredson episodes, and the debate is still
>>> open if Gottfredson & Co. weren't supposed to use Donald anymore or if they
>>> didn't WANT to use him anymore, because they had already fallen in love with
>>> the MM/GO duo.

Hmmm-- I wonder if he *would* have been included. This requires a little analysis of the kind of
stories he appeared in, and what Donald brought to the story / duo.

Oct '33 - Jan '34: "The Crazy Crime Wave"
I need to read it again to better imagine Donald in it

June 1934: "The Wise Little Hen"

Oct - Dec '34: "The Sacred Jewel"
Same as above

Dec '34: 'The Wise Little Hen" comic strip

Feb - March '35: "The Case of the Vanishing Coats"
Donald is a bumbling cowardly duck

March - June '35: "Editor-in-Grief"
Donald sells the paper but doesn't play a big part; Goofy accompanies Mickey, follows the gangsters

June - Sept '35: "Race for Riches"
The situation is serious: it is a race against time to help Clarabelle; besides being involved with
Clarabelle, Horace is brave enough to follow Mickey; the himor comes from the incidents rather than
the character

Sept '35 - jan' 36: "The Pirate Submarine"
Dead serious; not even Horace; Mickey teams up again with Gloomy-- the name fits in with the grave
matters at hand

Jan - March '36: "Oscar the Ostrich"
Goofy & Donald are but bit players; Donald does a bit more, acting as a competitor who plays tricks
on others

Aug - Nov '36: "The Seven Ghosts"
A funny spook story; Goofy & Donald goof around; Donald is the coward, Goofy the naive

Nov '36 - April '37: "Island in the Sky"
I really can't imagine Donald in this story

Aug '36 - Dec '37: Donald Duck "Silly Symphony" strips
Taliaferro & Karp then launch "Donald Duck" strips

I'd say Donald is still too cartoony,caricatural; he throws tantrums, is a big coward, and doesn't
do much else. Goofy's simple-mindedness makes for more serious gags: not slapstick but
character-driven-- ex: stays still while Mickey saves the day, then shakes his hand; "Muh hands?
Gawsh Mickey-- they never *was* tied! Pete told me tuh keep 'em behind me-- -so I did* !" ("Island
in the Sky"; March 18, 1937). It is also through Goofy's naivete that we are introduced to "The
Seven Ghosts".
The fact that Taliaferro started doing Duck strips probably was influential. I don't think, though,
it was just a matter of "You do the Mouse, you do the Duck, and you guys stick to your characters";
rather, the creation of the Donald Duck strip seems to have come about just at the same time
Gottfredson figured he didn't need Donald that much, felt he didn't really belong in the MM strip,
and was indeed better suited to the gag-a-day format of Taliaferro/Karp's strips.
[update: Gerd posted somthing interesting regarding the strips being sold to different newspapers]
Goofy in a sense is more serious, therefore a better companion for Mickey, whose adventures are
pretty serious after all. "The Mighty Whale Hunter" (Feb - July, '38), for instance, isn't merely
lifted from "The Whalers" (1938). Looking for adventure, Mickey decides to enlist on a whaler (with
Goofy) when he sees a poster reading "Men Wanted For voyage to northern waters for purpose of
capture of destructive whale!! Liberal bounty will be paid! Apply to Captain of boat 'Lady
Daffodil', foot of Maint St Wharf-- No weaklings need apply!" The last line is clear: there is no
place for Donald on board. It's nothing like Mickey's whaler: this is a "real" whaler, tough work &
danger and all (especially when a well-known villain appears). There is some humor, but not of the
Duck sort-- Goofy's umbrella for instance.
In short, even if he had been able to, I am not sure Gottfredson would have kept using Donald; once
in a while, for variety, but in the end, I guess he would have stopped anyway.

I wish I had time to get further into this analysis.

Olivier

Very interesting, David and all!

Can someone tell us how many pages long is the story D 2000-022 : "Les
Revenants de 'l'Ent?t?", or "Steamboat Willies", by Stefan Petrucha and
C?sar Ferioli?

Thanks,

Luca