Keskustelujen arkisto

SIGVALD GROSFJELD to OLAF SOLSTRAND, 15-08-2003:

> [...] some might thus say that [Rota] failed.

Geoffrey Blum, Marco Rota... Who'll be the next in line?

> And don't you think that Barks' managers at the time, would have
> seen such and act as a clear insult against Carl Barks' good name
> and reputation and thus sued Egmont for millions of $?

Imagine ANYONE sueing Egmont for stating that Scrooge and Grandma
are siblings! That's just nonsense, and I'll tell you why:

First,
even lawyers have a life.

Second,
a court room is no funny farm.

>> I think that even TODAY, one should be allowed to call himself a
>> "Barksist" without knowing this (IMO) rather unimportant fact.

> Maybe so, but wouldn't not knowing such basic details about the
> Ducks easily make such a person look a bit ignorant?

No, they wouldn't. Even Barks contradicted his own "facts".

>> Saying Scrooge was the brother of the wife of the son of Grandma
>> was as unlikely in Europe twenty years ago as it would have been
>> saying a thousand years ago that the Earth is round as a ball.

I didn't write this. What a serious act of disrespect! You got a
*whole* name wrong, instead of only a first name. You have access to
internet, so you easily could have checked that this comment came
from Emily Quack... er... Olaf Solstrand.

But... shall we conversate about some *positive* matters, Sigvald?

- Can you name five favourite artists?
- What are your favourite stories by these artists?
- Why do you like these stories?
- What are your favourite scenes?
- Which jokes did you like the most?
- What are your favourite characters?
- Are there situations in life which remind you of things you've read
in comics?
- What's the first story you ever read?

--- Dani?l

Hi Gilles!

> >Grandma Goofy
Original name: Grandma Goofy [GO's grandmother who wears a baseball jersey]
Finnish: Iso?iti Hissu
Italian: Nonna Peppa
Appearances: 2 (US Daily strips:1 ; US Sunday pages:1)
but this character isn't indexed anymore in COA...
> could anyone tell me the references of the strip ad the sunday page? if
anyone could provide scans and info on the character and on the plot, that'd
be nice

Grandma Goofy appears in three Gottfredson dailies, namely January 7, 8, and
10, 1955. We are at the beginning of the "Dr. X" continuity: Goofy has
disappeared, and Mickey phones Grandma to check whether he's at her place.
Grandma is a sweet old lady who sits in a comfy chair watching a wrestling
match on TV, with a baseball bat by her side ;-)

A Grandma Goofy had alreay appeared in the Sunday page of September 10, 1944
(drawn by Bill Wright). Grandma is going to stay at Goofy's for a while, and
has sent a heavy trunk in advance; Goofy is very undecided about which is
the best room in his house, so the trunk gets moved around a lot (by poor
Mickey) before finding its final sistemation. In the end, the room floor
gives in, and the trunk goes a few floors down; the final panel of the gag
shows Grandma in the basement, happily reading a book in her rocking chair.

I'll send you scans in a separate message.

Ciao,
Armando

Hey Sigvald,

>Michiel Prior wrote:
>
>> What I'm trying to say: This is probably the
>> way I'd like to see such a "Life of Pete"
>> being written: tying together various 'facts'
>> given in classic stories and cartoons and
>> portraying Pete as a rounder character than
>> the 'evil villain' he used to be.
>
>If that by any chance means ignoring all the classic tales by Gottfredson
>and Murry it would IMO make a "Life of Pete" pretty much nonsense.

Michael refers to "tying together... 'facts' given in classic
stories". I think when Michael says "classic stories", he MEANS Gottfredson
and Murry tales.
By the way, I ask you again please not to treat Murry stories as
being by Murry only. Murry is an artist. He didn't write them. Carl Fallberg
and Don Christensen, among others, wrote many of the best Pete stories drawn
by Murry.
Romano Scarpa is another great Pete story creator.

>I am not sure if that would be smart. Marco Rota once tried to write about
Donald's life. Many people, even here at DCML, think that he failed because
he didn't knew enough about Barks' views about the relations in the
Duck-family

I know a lot of people who think Marco's story is UNUSUAL, and they
may not agree with all the points in it, but that's not the same as calling
it a total FAILURE. Sigvald, who are the other DCMLers you refer to?

>Furthermore I think that, even though most often undeserved, Italian Disney
comics has, due to the high output, got an assembly-line mark on it. I would
therefore prefer that a well qualified American, like our friend David
Gerstein, to do such an important job - but that's just my thoughts.

You could say ANY high output of stories has an assembly-line mark
on it to some degree. S-codes, D-codes, H-codes, W-codes, B-codes... the
list goes on and on. But all of these production units also make, and have
made, a large number of good, classic stories. I don't see how the Italians
are any worse than anybody else in this regard.
In particular, I ask you please not to criticize them on MY
behalf... though I know you're trying to pay me a compliment (and thanks for
that!).
You know, Sig, a few of my own favorite Pete stories are classic
Italian stories.

>Anyway the most important issue here IMO, is that whoever selected to do a
"Life of Pete" should care as much about the works of Gottfredson and/or
Murry

...and Romano Scarpa, who IMHO contributed as much to Pete as the
other creators you cite. My Egmont colleagues Byron Erickson and Andreas
Pihl have also done some excellent Pete stories in recent years.

Best wishes,
David

It's funny: I tried to discuss Italian Mouse stories,
someone mentioned the only Italian artist he seems to know
about and suddenly we're in the middle of yet another
familiar, chewed-out and often-repeated discussion about
grandma-and-scrooge-as-siblings and
do-ducks-hatch-from-eggs. Sure, a Rota story is a worthy
subject for this mailinglist, but somehow it's always this
particular Donald's-birth-story. Nothing new here.

So, let's try and get back to my original subject:

Marco Rota also drew Mouse stories, which I've never seen.
Judging from his Duck stories, I would expect his Mouse
art to look more traditional, more 'American', just like
Danish and Dutch Duck artists look at Carl Barks for
reference.

The other, 'new' Italian artwork often looks totally
different and imho more exciting. Judging from the stories
in "Topolino Noir", Giorgio Cavazzano or Corrado
Mastantonuo could do great things on a project like
"Life-of-Pete", with proper respect to, for example,
classic Gottfredson or Scarpa stories.

Dane <danehog at aol.com>:

> Personally, I'm not a big fan of Scarpa's Duck work. [...]> the characters just don't have any... *substance* behind > them. I'm sure Scarpa is a perfectly capable artist, as a > whole, but there's something about his Duck style that
> just doesn't work for me. It's just so... generic. Still, > it could be *much* worse. Perhaps I'm just not "used" to > his style yet. I don't know. Whatever the case, I'm not
> much of a Scarpa fan. (Can you tell yet?)

> [...] The coloring seems much too "light" for his
> stationary style, giving it an obnoxious look that almost > gives me a headache. I'm sure Scarpa's work looks *much* > better in black-and-white.

I have to admit that I needed to get used to his drawings
before I could appreciate it. My first reaction was: "This
is bad! The characters show strange facial expressions and
are much too 'jumpy' (display a sort of 'elasticity')."
But then I read the story over and over and when I got
used to it, his style actually worked. I had the same with
Toby Strobl and what I used to call 'these weird modern
Italian artists'. The difference being that I *love*
Cavazzano and *appreciate* Scarpa.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts on Scarpa's work.
I hope other members will join this discussion.

David Gerstein:

> Michael refers to "tying together... 'facts' given in
> classic stories". I think when Michael says "classic
> stories", he MEANS Gottfredson and Murry tales. [...]
> Romano Scarpa is another great Pete story creator.

Well, yes, I meant Gottfredson and Murry and Scarpa, but
to be honest: I'm only familiar with Gottfredson. Please
tell me about Murry and Scarpa.

And I'm sure there must be many others. I don't think such
a 'Life-of-Pete'-series should strictly refer to the works
of two or three authors only, although I admit it wouldn't
be an easy job and such an restriction could serve as a
useful 'boundary'. References to cartoons like "Steamboat
Willie" would also be nice (like Tito Faraci did). The
choice of a workable boundary would also depend on the
preferences of the artists, of course.

Oh, and David, I liked your expansion on the various
versions of the 'Foul Fellows' Club' from the Wolf
stories.

Michiel Prior.

Personally, I like *most* of Scarpa's duck art, and I like all of his mouse art that I've seen. I like the elasticity and rubberiness of what he does, though I do think that his ducks in particular sometimes have odd expressions on their faces. I'm especially fond of the way he draws the Beagle Boys. Since Dane mentioned not being fond of the latest American printed Scarpa story, I may recommend Amundson's Talisman (DD279) which is one of my favorite non-Barks/Rosa/Van Horn stories (along with Verhagan's 'Footsteps of Jules Verne' which is as good as any Barks in my mind). Anyhow, you may like that story better.

I also enjoy the Rota and Cavazanno art that I've seen, though I must admit a strong dislike for the Andold stories that Rota has worked on. I find them *extremely* boring for some reason, though Rota's duck art is always very strong.

I'm hoping that Gemstone will see fit to give us some Scarpa Mouse stories soon (and any stories with Cavazanno art).

rodney.

PS---What exactly is a Barksist and a Donaldist. I don't think I'm either, but I'd like to know.

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Michiel Prior wrote:

> The characters Scarpa draws display a sort of 'elasticity' and they
> 'overact' a bit. Not that I don't think he's a good artist, but I'm
> curious what his fans like about his work. Maybe we could discuss
> this a bit?

Of course, here I am :-)
Me, I consider Scarpa the greatest of all, so I thought I should join the
discussion!

I've always loved his style, since I was three... I should have said
"styles" actually, because his old stories (from the fifties) are quite
different, graphically than his later stories (from the Seventies on). And I
had no idea it was the same artist way back then (of course! I didn't even
know his name).

Tthere's another thing to keep in mind: there are stories only drawn by him
and there are stories written and drawn by him.
Don Rosa once wrote:
"I think any comic that is written and drawn by ONE person, even if it's
mediocre, has a quality that puts it somehow above the best comic written
and drawn by two different people."
And I think he's right... in this case it's not even mediocre comics we're
talking about, but great ones.

So if people don't find "The Big Break-In" that great, it's just because...
it's not that great. Scarpa just pencilled it, he did not write it.
He did a lot of S-coded stories just as he does now a lot of D-coded
stories, but not being written by him (and generally being *very* short)
they don't do justice to his art. (I daresay that "History Re-Petes Itself"
is an exception, and it's the best D-coded story ever, IMHO) (not because
David is here, but just because I really love it).

In the US you've had some examples of the "real" Scarpa with the Gladstone
runs... let me see...
Well, you've had the Flying Scot, that's my favourite Disney story ever. So
let's get down to the point here... why I like it. The story is from the
50's, so the art is "old style"... quite "round" and soft. But I guess that
art is generally a matter of taste. What I like besides the art, are the
characters and the plot. Besides being Barksian even before Barks (the usual
talk about how some years later Barks had the ducks meet a flying vessel
too, but this is not important), Scrooge, Donald and the nephews are real
characters here. Scrooge is the Scrooge I love (100% Barksian, if you like
it so, but not only so). He feels lonely so he gets this bird, the Kaibi',
and then does anything he can to feed him. This loneliness of him is not
something you get in everyday's stories... the same goes for the ending of
the story. I won't give it away in case you haven't read it yet (do it), but
let's just say that what's behind it is the same feeling you get at the end
of "Back to the Klondike". A sort of "I do good after all, but I don't want
anybody to know". The same concept is behind another Scarpa story, "McDuck
Foundation".
So the characters is the thing I like most in Scarpa stories... they're
real, just as Barks' characters were (sometimes even more, in my opinion),
and characters is the thing I'm interested most in every kind of fiction.

Then we have the plot. But that's not easy to explain, it's just to be read
actually... when it's not based on the development of some characters (and
we're back to characters in this case) it generally is the classic
go-find-a-way-to-make-money adventure (Like the Colossus of Rhodes), like
typical Barks' stories. Nothing much to say here... they're just well
balanced, it seems you're looking at a (very good) movie. They're very
"cinematographic", if such word exists.

This for ducks, but Scarpa works with mice just as much as he does with
ducks!
And his mice are perfectly Gottfredson-like. Everybody knows that when
Gottfredson had to stop make real stories and had to turn to self-conclusive
strips, Scarpa in Italy "took his place" continuing from where he'd started
(drawing strips that he himself remounted right away in the pocket format),
forcing himself into using the strip format (In The Mystery of Tapiocus VI),
so to have a gag or a cliffhanger or something every 4 or 5 panels. If you
love strips, you can't but love this style too, since after all, it's the
same thing. (In the nineties he did 4 real strip stories, and IMO they're
among the best things appeared in the nineties... it'd be great if Gemstone
published them)
He did not always use the strip format of course, but in the 50's he also
created some of the greatest detective stories seen in Disney comics. You
can read Kali's nail for an example of this. These are very tight stories,
written around the character of Mickey that was the real Mickey, the one
from Gottfredson stories, not a detective that happens to have two big ears
(as sometimes happens)

Later, from the seventies on, he did something so unusual in Disney comics
(except Gottfredson and Don Rosa) that it passed unnoticed: he kept a
continuity in his Mickey stories. He had Ellsworth's stepson, Bruto, come
live with him, and since then all of his Mickey stories have featured Bruto,
sometimes even openly quoting old stories in a new one. I love this
consistency, it's not easily found in Disney Comics. And it'd be great if
these stories could see the light in the US (possibily in order of course),
since none of them has yet.

One last thing is the characters he himself created... he did not sat at
ease on what he already had, but when he felt that a new character was
needed, he created and made it as real as the existing one... think for
example of Brigitta, the only one well-known in the US too... she is a
complex and interesting character.

So I just hope that some of his (written by him) long stories will see the
light in the US, otherwise he's gonna be seen just as one of many.

Best,
Francesco
http://www.dimensionedelta.net

These questions weren't intended for me, but I'll try to answer them anyway.

Dani?l wrote:

> - Can you name five favourite artists?
Carl Barks, Al Taliaferro, Floyd Gottfredson, Paul Murry, Tony Strobl.

> - What are your favourite stories by these artists?
Barks: The Old Castle's Secret (4 Color 189)
Taliaferro: various Sunday pages from the 1940s.
Gottfredson: The Phantom Blot (dailies from 1939)
Murry: The Last Resort (WDC 152-154)
Strobl: Keelboat To Kickapoo (Vacation in Disneyland 1)

> - Why do you like these stories?
Probably because I read them at the "right" age, about 8-10 years.

> - What are your favourite scenes?
When the money dam bursts in 'Only a Poor Old Man'

> - Which jokes did you like the most?
When the parrot in "the Pixilated Parrot" (Barks) gets in love and counts
the chicks of a female parrot.
Many Mickey Sunday pages by Manuel Gonzales, featuring Goofy and/or
Ellsworth, usually from 1946-52.
When Goofy makes sound effects in a radio show (don't remember which story,
but probably a Goofy Dell One-Shot with art by Phil de Lara).

> - What are your favourite characters?
Donald, Goofy.

> - Are there situations in life which remind you of things you've read
> in comics?
That happens every day.

> - What's the first story you ever read?
That must have been before the age of 4, so I don't remember.
One of the first I remember was a story, probably by Strobl, with Donald,
the nephews and Bolivar from 1958-9, I guess. I remember Bolivar sleeping on
the porch in front of the door (or perhaps just lying there).

Kjell

Something curious. Yesterday while I was at work I was listening to the
News when the Electricity Blackout occurred on the East Coast (from
Toronto to New York and Illinois, etc. It was of great interest, as
many might understand, since we do have a fear of terrorist attacks in
our country right now. But that aside, at one point, during the day,
the newscaster mentioned the names of two of the facilities or grids or
something that provided the power and called them "Terry" and "Firmy."
I'm sure someone was a Barks fan working for the power company.

I tried to find out more information on these names by doing a word
search, but could only come up with Barks references or people who have
those as first names.

I wish I could say more, but I thought this might be of some minor
interest here.

Thanks,

Rich Bellacera