Daniel van Eijmeren to Francesco Spreafico:
> I want to emphasize that I've enjoyed your enthusiastic
> account of Scarpa's work.
And I agree! It's very nice to have a discussion on 'new'
creators whose work I still have to discover. And it's
nice to get suggestions for good stories to start with.
"The Flying Scot" has been printed in Holland in DD
1998-35, so I'll try to get my hands on a copy.
Look! >http://dd50.inducks.org/xned1998.html<
Sigvald:
> It's a Gottfredson-fact that Pete once went around
> with a wooden-leg.
This is, in fact, a Disney-fact from Pete's early cartoon
appearances.
> Pete had his peg leg until 1936 in the cartoons. In the
> comics it lasted until 1941, when the story Mystery at
> Hidden River explained how he had gotten an artifical leg > that looked real. Occasionally he resumed his peg leg in > later stories though, for example in The World of
> Tomorrow (1944).
I found this information at:
>http://stp.ling.uu.se/~starback/dcml/chars/blackpete.html<
Michiel Prior.
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Author
Topic: 200308
(787 messages)
M.J. Prior
Scarpa, Pete's leg
Message 406 -
2003-08-17 at 15:19:03
Sigvald Grøsfjeld Jr.
The Italian Duck universe
Message 407 -
2003-08-17 at 15:24:41
Hi all!
As my friends SKO and Olaf have addressed my comments about the Italian
Duck-universe, I find it in place to further express my view in order to end
possible misunderstandings.
First, I do like Italian stories. They are often long and pretty
unpredictable. So I do purchase each Donald Duck Pocket book as soon as they
reaches the stores, and FYI I am the happy owner of all 273 issues that has
been published here in Norway so far. And furthermore I even like most of
the Italian characters (the secretary, the butler, Brigitta, etc.)
Second I do differ between *adding* new characters like Arpine L?sene, Jos?
Carioca, Panchito Pistoles, etc. (who really don't contradict Barks'
universe), and *changes of what I would like to call constants in Barks'
universe like the look of he Money Bin, the look of Scrooge's secretary, the
fact that $crooge normally doesn't have a butler, etc. The first is
expanding/developing The Duck universe as Barks constituted it ? the second
is creating a parallel twin Duck universe based on the old original one that
Barks once constituted. The last may be as interesting and funny to read
about as the first. However monumental tales about the life and history of
characters in the Duck universe should IMHO be based on the original Duck
universe ? not its nice twin.
Sigvald
As my friends SKO and Olaf have addressed my comments about the Italian
Duck-universe, I find it in place to further express my view in order to end
possible misunderstandings.
First, I do like Italian stories. They are often long and pretty
unpredictable. So I do purchase each Donald Duck Pocket book as soon as they
reaches the stores, and FYI I am the happy owner of all 273 issues that has
been published here in Norway so far. And furthermore I even like most of
the Italian characters (the secretary, the butler, Brigitta, etc.)
Second I do differ between *adding* new characters like Arpine L?sene, Jos?
Carioca, Panchito Pistoles, etc. (who really don't contradict Barks'
universe), and *changes of what I would like to call constants in Barks'
universe like the look of he Money Bin, the look of Scrooge's secretary, the
fact that $crooge normally doesn't have a butler, etc. The first is
expanding/developing The Duck universe as Barks constituted it ? the second
is creating a parallel twin Duck universe based on the old original one that
Barks once constituted. The last may be as interesting and funny to read
about as the first. However monumental tales about the life and history of
characters in the Duck universe should IMHO be based on the original Duck
universe ? not its nice twin.
Sigvald
M.J. Prior
Ole: "Topolino Noir"
Message 408 -
2003-08-17 at 16:28:41
Ole R. Nielsen:
> [Tito Faraci] as a writer has a more adult-oriented
> approach. Having read several of the stories in the
> book, I would say that his scripts are not meant for
> children. Even his dialogue is too hard for me to read in > the original Italian with my limited skills [...]
When I bought "Topolino Noir" in the dusty town of Napoli,
the book was wrapped in plastic and I couldn't take a look
inside before buying it, otherwise I'd have to damage the
silly plastic wrapping. What I expected, judging from the
book's appearance, was serious and indeed 'more
adult-oriented' Mickey stories and I couldn't be more
pleased with what I got (after angrily tearing up the
plastic :).
The stories have indeed more complicated storylines, but
not to the same degree in every story. Silvia Ziche's
"Topolino e il genio nell'ombra" should be easy to grasp
for children: it's a very funny and rather silly story,
due to the fact that most of the humour depends on the
villains and the heroes both acting very stupid. Goofy and
Manetta don't have the slightest notion of the 'danger'
they're in. Ziche's artwork is at least easily accessible
and probably improves when coloured. (Hey, I could colour
it myself! :)
> On a last note I must express my disappointment with you > for forgetting to mention Paolo Mottura, considering that > it is his story which leads the book.
Let's give credit where credit's due: Mottura is very good
at detailed interior-scenes and he has a good
'cinematographic' storytelling-approach. His last panel
(an airplane-view of a city) is beautiful(!) and there's
also a brilliant pastiche on Salvador Dali in this story
(you can see the artist on the next page!). I just don't
happen to like his 'people'.
Did you notice that the dialogue of "Sfida a Topolinia"
(by Cavazzano) is entirely written without using the
letter 'e'?
And I also forgot to mention "Topolino e l'incredibile
Vladimir", with artwork by Massimo de Vita. This story is
imo also easily accessible for children. De Vita's artwork
is good and I like the way he draws Minnie (and his other
characters in general, with the exception of l'ispettore
Manetta).
Cavazzano's Manetta looks more intelligent and more kind,
which is how I like him better. I think this has something
to do with the way Cavazzano draws him: with a shorter
'snout' and larger eyes than the other artists'
representation of Manetta (detective Casey).
Michiel Prior.
> [Tito Faraci] as a writer has a more adult-oriented
> approach. Having read several of the stories in the
> book, I would say that his scripts are not meant for
> children. Even his dialogue is too hard for me to read in > the original Italian with my limited skills [...]
When I bought "Topolino Noir" in the dusty town of Napoli,
the book was wrapped in plastic and I couldn't take a look
inside before buying it, otherwise I'd have to damage the
silly plastic wrapping. What I expected, judging from the
book's appearance, was serious and indeed 'more
adult-oriented' Mickey stories and I couldn't be more
pleased with what I got (after angrily tearing up the
plastic :).
The stories have indeed more complicated storylines, but
not to the same degree in every story. Silvia Ziche's
"Topolino e il genio nell'ombra" should be easy to grasp
for children: it's a very funny and rather silly story,
due to the fact that most of the humour depends on the
villains and the heroes both acting very stupid. Goofy and
Manetta don't have the slightest notion of the 'danger'
they're in. Ziche's artwork is at least easily accessible
and probably improves when coloured. (Hey, I could colour
it myself! :)
> On a last note I must express my disappointment with you > for forgetting to mention Paolo Mottura, considering that > it is his story which leads the book.
Let's give credit where credit's due: Mottura is very good
at detailed interior-scenes and he has a good
'cinematographic' storytelling-approach. His last panel
(an airplane-view of a city) is beautiful(!) and there's
also a brilliant pastiche on Salvador Dali in this story
(you can see the artist on the next page!). I just don't
happen to like his 'people'.
Did you notice that the dialogue of "Sfida a Topolinia"
(by Cavazzano) is entirely written without using the
letter 'e'?
And I also forgot to mention "Topolino e l'incredibile
Vladimir", with artwork by Massimo de Vita. This story is
imo also easily accessible for children. De Vita's artwork
is good and I like the way he draws Minnie (and his other
characters in general, with the exception of l'ispettore
Manetta).
Cavazzano's Manetta looks more intelligent and more kind,
which is how I like him better. I think this has something
to do with the way Cavazzano draws him: with a shorter
'snout' and larger eyes than the other artists'
representation of Manetta (detective Casey).
Michiel Prior.
Frank Bubacz
Scarpa, Pete's leg
Message 409 -
2003-08-17 at 17:29:08
Michiel quoted:
>Pete had his peg leg until 1936 in the cartoons. In the comics it lasted
>until 1941, when the story Mystery at Hidden River explained how he had
>gotten an artifical leg that looked real.
Interestingly, the first bunch of Italian Disney artists, Bioletto, Carpi,
Chierchini, P.L. de Vita et al, drew Pete with a wooden leg until as late as
ca. 1960. The only exception was Scarpa, probably due to the strong
Gottfredson influence. There's a nice scene in his story "Topolino e la
dimensione Delta" (1959), when Pete takes off one of his shoes and
underneath you can see his pegleg!
I personally adore Scarpa and think it's high time his classic MM stories of
the 50s and early 60s see publication in the US. Only three have ever been
published there: "The Blot's Double Mystery", "The Mystery Of Tapiocus VI"
and "Kali's Nail". There are still about ten of his MM stories from that era
that are absolutely indispensable. I guess the problem is they are drawn to
fit a pocket book format, and of course it's sacrilege to change a 3-tier
into a 4-tier.
Frank
_________________________________________________________________
MSN - More Useful Every Day http://www.msn.de
>Pete had his peg leg until 1936 in the cartoons. In the comics it lasted
>until 1941, when the story Mystery at Hidden River explained how he had
>gotten an artifical leg that looked real.
Interestingly, the first bunch of Italian Disney artists, Bioletto, Carpi,
Chierchini, P.L. de Vita et al, drew Pete with a wooden leg until as late as
ca. 1960. The only exception was Scarpa, probably due to the strong
Gottfredson influence. There's a nice scene in his story "Topolino e la
dimensione Delta" (1959), when Pete takes off one of his shoes and
underneath you can see his pegleg!
I personally adore Scarpa and think it's high time his classic MM stories of
the 50s and early 60s see publication in the US. Only three have ever been
published there: "The Blot's Double Mystery", "The Mystery Of Tapiocus VI"
and "Kali's Nail". There are still about ten of his MM stories from that era
that are absolutely indispensable. I guess the problem is they are drawn to
fit a pocket book format, and of course it's sacrilege to change a 3-tier
into a 4-tier.
Frank
_________________________________________________________________
MSN - More Useful Every Day http://www.msn.de
Francesco Spreafico
Scarpa, Pete's leg
Message 410 -
2003-08-17 at 17:37:54
Frank Bubacz wrote:
> I personally adore Scarpa and think it's high time his classic MM
> stories of the 50s and early 60s see publication in the US. Only
> three have ever been published there: "The Blot's Double Mystery",
> "The Mystery Of Tapiocus VI" and "Kali's Nail". There are still about
> ten of his MM stories from that era that are absolutely
> indispensable. I guess the problem is they are drawn to fit a pocket
> book format, and of course it's sacrilege to change a 3-tier into a
> 4-tier.
There's the new "Take-Along" for that, isn't there? When I first saw it I
started hoping...
--
Francesco
http://www.dimensionedelta.net/scarpa
> I personally adore Scarpa and think it's high time his classic MM
> stories of the 50s and early 60s see publication in the US. Only
> three have ever been published there: "The Blot's Double Mystery",
> "The Mystery Of Tapiocus VI" and "Kali's Nail". There are still about
> ten of his MM stories from that era that are absolutely
> indispensable. I guess the problem is they are drawn to fit a pocket
> book format, and of course it's sacrilege to change a 3-tier into a
> 4-tier.
There's the new "Take-Along" for that, isn't there? When I first saw it I
started hoping...
--
Francesco
http://www.dimensionedelta.net/scarpa
Francesco Spreafico
"Topolino Noir"
Message 411 -
2003-08-17 at 17:48:19
M.J. Prior wrote:
> Let's give credit where credit's due: Mottura is very good
> at detailed interior-scenes and he has a good
> 'cinematographic' storytelling-approach. His last panel
> (an airplane-view of a city) is beautiful(!) and there's
> also a brilliant pastiche on Salvador Dali in this story
> (you can see the artist on the next page!). I just don't
> happen to like his 'people'.
Oh! I perfectly agree with this opinion of yours... I've been trying to
understand what I liked and what I didn't like in Mottura's art for a lot of
time, and I think that actually it was this simple. I used to say that I
think Mottura should do non-disney comics, now I see why :-)
> Did you notice that the dialogue of "Sfida a Topolinia"
> (by Cavazzano) is entirely written without using the
> letter 'e'?
There even was a contest on Topolino when the story was fisrt published...
"What's strange in this story?", and I didn't realize untile they explained
it some weeks later.
--
Francesco
http://www.dimensionedelta.net/scarpa/
"Vi faccio vedere *io* chi sono *io*!! *Io* vi compro la fabbrica e
*tutto*!!"
~ Scrooge, from I TL 174-A
> Let's give credit where credit's due: Mottura is very good
> at detailed interior-scenes and he has a good
> 'cinematographic' storytelling-approach. His last panel
> (an airplane-view of a city) is beautiful(!) and there's
> also a brilliant pastiche on Salvador Dali in this story
> (you can see the artist on the next page!). I just don't
> happen to like his 'people'.
Oh! I perfectly agree with this opinion of yours... I've been trying to
understand what I liked and what I didn't like in Mottura's art for a lot of
time, and I think that actually it was this simple. I used to say that I
think Mottura should do non-disney comics, now I see why :-)
> Did you notice that the dialogue of "Sfida a Topolinia"
> (by Cavazzano) is entirely written without using the
> letter 'e'?
There even was a contest on Topolino when the story was fisrt published...
"What's strange in this story?", and I didn't realize untile they explained
it some weeks later.
--
Francesco
http://www.dimensionedelta.net/scarpa/
"Vi faccio vedere *io* chi sono *io*!! *Io* vi compro la fabbrica e
*tutto*!!"
~ Scrooge, from I TL 174-A
Francesco Spreafico
Scarpa, Pete's leg
Message 412 -
2003-08-17 at 17:51:07
M.J. Prior wrote:
> And I agree! It's very nice to have a discussion on 'new'
> creators whose work I still have to discover.
It freaks me a bit hearing somebody defining Scarpa 'new' :-)
> "The Flying Scot" has been printed in Holland in DD
> 1998-35, so I'll try to get my hands on a copy.
>
> Look! >http://dd50.inducks.org/xned1998.html<
That is *so* weird! I'd never seen it remounted!
--
Francesco
http://www.dimensionedelta.net/scarpa/
"Vi faccio vedere *io* chi sono *io*!! *Io* vi compro la fabbrica e
*tutto*!!"
~ Scrooge, from I TL 174-A
> And I agree! It's very nice to have a discussion on 'new'
> creators whose work I still have to discover.
It freaks me a bit hearing somebody defining Scarpa 'new' :-)
> "The Flying Scot" has been printed in Holland in DD
> 1998-35, so I'll try to get my hands on a copy.
>
> Look! >http://dd50.inducks.org/xned1998.html<
That is *so* weird! I'd never seen it remounted!
--
Francesco
http://www.dimensionedelta.net/scarpa/
"Vi faccio vedere *io* chi sono *io*!! *Io* vi compro la fabbrica e
*tutto*!!"
~ Scrooge, from I TL 174-A
Daniel Van Eijmeren
The Italian Duck universe
Message 413 -
2003-08-17 at 17:54:36
SIGVALD GROSFJELD, 17-08-2003:
> *changes of what I would like to call constants in Barks' universe
> like the look of he Money Bin, the look of Scrooge's secretary, the
> fact that $crooge normally doesn't have a butler, etc.
No, you are referring to the ROSA UNIVERSE, once again...
In Barks's universe, these points are no constant "facts" at all:
- Scrooge has many different money bins, like the egg shaped one in
the super-strong forbidium money bin story (DISBP 1) and the
money bin at a Duckburg street. (The Golden River, US 22.)
- Scrooge has different secretaries and clerks
- Scrooge has a mansion and a butler
> However monumental tales about the life and history of characters
> in the Duck universe should IMHO be based on the original Duck
> universe ? not its nice twin.
Know what you say. The Rosa universe should also be ignored then!
It's not original. It's a retrospective universe, with exceptions
to the "original" universe. These exceptions are even a proof that
the "original" universe was not intended to be structured in
retrospective at all. So, why force them together into one jar?
And... even Barks *himself* adjusted his Ducks to what other Disney
artists did, at the time when he was *creating* the "Barks universe".
What I find surprising is that Rosa-fans generally tend to credit
Barks for Rosa's efforts. It's unfair and unreasonable. As if Rosa's
creations need some kind of "Barks approval" label being forced on
them, in order to make them worthwhile. This is the reason why some
people look at Rosa as being an inferior version of Barks, instead
of being a good artist in his own right. It's almost impossible to
like "Rosa the artist", because the image of "Rosa the heir" always
pops up instead...
In other words, mixing up Barks and Rosa is a way for Rosa-fans to
shoot themselves in the foot, and to get involved in a *lot* of
quarrel and misunderstandings.
And why?
Carl Barks = Carl Barks
Don Rosa = Don Rosa
Romana Scarpa = Romano Scarpa
I've never heard of Disney artists named Carl Rosa, Don Barks, Romano
Rosa, or Carl Scarpa. So, why should we pretend that they do exist?
(Please Sigvald, I don't want to go through this again. Do you?)
Can't we just all agree that different artists have different styles
and opinions? And that it's not up to you - or me - to tell which
style and opinion is superior or inferior? Or do you like to *hurt*
people by suggesting that your opinion is superior? That's what
you're doing when you write that way, because you're attacking their
enthusiasm for interpreting comics in their own way and taste. And
when people feel attacked they can get very defensive and angry.
This results in flaming, and a bad atmosphere. End result is a
downward spiral in which NOBODY - including you - is enjoying this
mailing list and their comics anymore.
So, be more tolerant and positive towards others.
It's also for your own good.
A world in which people even hurt each other's fantasies and dreams,
is no better than hell. Let's keep that pain and suffering out of our
little idyllic DCML-garden. Okay?
--- Dani?l
> *changes of what I would like to call constants in Barks' universe
> like the look of he Money Bin, the look of Scrooge's secretary, the
> fact that $crooge normally doesn't have a butler, etc.
No, you are referring to the ROSA UNIVERSE, once again...
In Barks's universe, these points are no constant "facts" at all:
- Scrooge has many different money bins, like the egg shaped one in
the super-strong forbidium money bin story (DISBP 1) and the
money bin at a Duckburg street. (The Golden River, US 22.)
- Scrooge has different secretaries and clerks
- Scrooge has a mansion and a butler
> However monumental tales about the life and history of characters
> in the Duck universe should IMHO be based on the original Duck
> universe ? not its nice twin.
Know what you say. The Rosa universe should also be ignored then!
It's not original. It's a retrospective universe, with exceptions
to the "original" universe. These exceptions are even a proof that
the "original" universe was not intended to be structured in
retrospective at all. So, why force them together into one jar?
And... even Barks *himself* adjusted his Ducks to what other Disney
artists did, at the time when he was *creating* the "Barks universe".
What I find surprising is that Rosa-fans generally tend to credit
Barks for Rosa's efforts. It's unfair and unreasonable. As if Rosa's
creations need some kind of "Barks approval" label being forced on
them, in order to make them worthwhile. This is the reason why some
people look at Rosa as being an inferior version of Barks, instead
of being a good artist in his own right. It's almost impossible to
like "Rosa the artist", because the image of "Rosa the heir" always
pops up instead...
In other words, mixing up Barks and Rosa is a way for Rosa-fans to
shoot themselves in the foot, and to get involved in a *lot* of
quarrel and misunderstandings.
And why?
Carl Barks = Carl Barks
Don Rosa = Don Rosa
Romana Scarpa = Romano Scarpa
I've never heard of Disney artists named Carl Rosa, Don Barks, Romano
Rosa, or Carl Scarpa. So, why should we pretend that they do exist?
(Please Sigvald, I don't want to go through this again. Do you?)
Can't we just all agree that different artists have different styles
and opinions? And that it's not up to you - or me - to tell which
style and opinion is superior or inferior? Or do you like to *hurt*
people by suggesting that your opinion is superior? That's what
you're doing when you write that way, because you're attacking their
enthusiasm for interpreting comics in their own way and taste. And
when people feel attacked they can get very defensive and angry.
This results in flaming, and a bad atmosphere. End result is a
downward spiral in which NOBODY - including you - is enjoying this
mailing list and their comics anymore.
So, be more tolerant and positive towards others.
It's also for your own good.
A world in which people even hurt each other's fantasies and dreams,
is no better than hell. Let's keep that pain and suffering out of our
little idyllic DCML-garden. Okay?
--- Dani?l
Francesco Spreafico
Gemstone
Message 414 -
2003-08-17 at 19:24:55
I thought I'd comment on the first Gemstone issues... (I'm sendind this to
the Gemstone's letter columns, so if I say something I've already said,
that's the reason)
Walt Disney Comics and Stories #634
- DD The Hard Boiled Duck: I hadn't liked much this story when it had been
published on Zio Paperone last November... but now I liked it! I guess that
Van Horn's dialogs are much better in English than they are in Italian
(still I can't say I like his art, but that's a matter of taste of course).
- MM Checkmate: Nothing particular, I don't generally like the use of the
Phantom Blot in short stories like this. Is the Big Bad, and so he should be
used in my opinion.
- GL Party of none!: I liked this one (even though I've grown a bit tired of
Vicar's late stories, I think his lost the touch he had when he drew stories
like the one with the Klondike pipeline, my favorite of his). It was nice to
see Glastone out of luck, even though I think we've already seen him in
similar conditions a thousand of times.
- JW New Zoo Brews Ado: I'm not a big fan of these Jippes' remakes, even
though they're much better than the original ones, but since they exist I
think they must be published, since Barks deserves to be published!
Walt Disney Comics and Stories #635
- JW Hound of Moaning Hills: Same as the above (but I liked this one more).
Weird thing: at the same time it was published in Italy, last month on Zio
Paperone.
- MM Spidermouse: Please no Mickey meets Peter Parker stories!
- DD The 3 Caballeros Ride Again: Rosa in English is always a pleasure to
read! Even if I don't like the 3 Caballeros (but I like the story, that I'd
already read in Italian)
Uncle Scrooge 319
- US The Duchman's Secret: Now *this* is fun! One of my favourite Rosa
stories in English, that's something! Great story, and great ending, always
loved the way Scrooge gets the crook jailed. And great idea to have an
article by him explaining some things about the story!
- US Worldwide Widgets: How strange to see Fethry in an American Comic Book.
But a good thing, I hope to see more of him, maybe some classical story by
Kinney and Hubbard! (Or by Pezzin and Cavazzano)
- DD Terror of the Beagle Boys: There always has to be some Barks of course,
even though we've already read all of his stories one thousand times. I just
wonder, how come the story looks so strange? It seems that it comes from and
actual old printing of it, and not from the original... I don't know how
they're called in English, "prints"?
Uncle Scrooge 320
- US Fools of the Trade: This one too is better in English, but I'm not a
big fan of Van Horn's art (while I'm becoming fan of his writing)
- US The Big Break-In: FINALLY some Scarpa back in the US! The story is just
a short S-coded story, not written by him, so it's nothing special, but the
art is great! (Even though I see there's something wrong with the inks of
this printing... no problems in my Italian editions of the same story, what
happened here?)
- GG The Madball Pitcher: Another Barks here, very nice, but the printing is
as the above... huh?
- US World Wide Witch: This story have caused a lot of talk... me I like it,
I find it's a nice story... not a masterpiece at all, but decent and nice
and funny, what a short non-pretencious story should be. I was also happy to
see the article by Blum himself explaining stuff... good job. (Articles are
always good, the more, the better)
Donald Duck Adventures 1
(This was a little surprise!)
- DD The Deep: Now, how creepy was this? I really loved this one, what a
surprise! Authors completely unknown to me... nice art, better than the
average) and nice plot!
- MM Panicking Pachiderms: well, nice one! Nothing special, but nice after
all.
- US Time of Reckoning: same here... even though I've seen thousands of
stories like this in Italy on "Topolino"...
So far I'm satisfied of what I'm getting. They're a bit expensive to tell
the truth, but nothing can be done for this, I know.
What I'd like to see in the future:
First I hope that it'll last much longer than Gladstone... possibly
indefinitely! How's it *really* going economically, anybody knows? Geppi
keeps buying expensive stuff at various auctions, is this a good sign? ;-)
Anyway, I was saying:
- Everything by Don Rosa: they were written in English and the only way to
really appreciate them deeply is to read them in English, so let them come!
- Stories written and drawn by Romano Scarpa: there are so many classical
stories from the Fifties (Both Ducks and Mice!) not published by
Gladstone... each one of them should be published in a nice edition and with
a good translation (possibily without "barks-in' 'em up" as it happenned
with the "Colossus of Rhodes" years ago... if there are no references to
Barks in a story let's not make them up, that's my opinion). Since there is
now this new pocket "Take-Along" comic book, it seems to me that it would be
the best place where to publish Scarpa (or any Italian 3-tiered stories), so
there would be no need to remount 3-tiers into 4-tiers.
I'd also love to see Scarpa's more recent (From the Seventies on) Mickey
stories, featuring Ellsworth's stepson... they're all part of a real
continuity so they should be published in order. These includes 4 strip
stories made at the beginning of the Ninenties, (really wonderful stuff) and
the 8-parter "Paperolimpiadi" starring both Ducks and Mice made in 1988 for
the Seoul Olympics, a true masterpiece.
- Anything by Gottfredson: he's still so little known in the US compared to
Barks, while he should be known by anyone. I guess the problem here is the
strip format... I wouldn't really know how to do, since I'd hate to have to
remount the strips, but... any affordable alternatives?
- Other Italian stuff: Lots. But most of all I'd love to see Massimo De
Vita's fantasy "Ice Sword Trilogy", undoubtedly the masterpiece of this
great Italian artist. It'd be great (and also almost impossible) to see
"Storia e Gloria della Dinastia dei Paperi" ("History and Glory of the
Ducks' Dynasty", and 8-part story made in 1971 by Guido Martina, Romano
Scarpa and Giovan Battista Carpi about the history of the Ducks, starting
from the ancient Egypt. Completely non-Barksian, since Scrooge, for example,
is born in Klondike, but I don't care much, since it's really fascinating).
And stories by Giorgio Cavazzano, Massimo De Vita, Luciano Bottaro, Giovan
Battista Carpi, Silvia Ziche and many others... Oh I was forgetting: the
recent "Bay Stories" written by Alberto Savini, probably the nicest thing
made in Italy in the latest years.
I guess that's all. What do you all think about it so far?
--
Francesco
http://www.dimensionedelta.net/scarpa/
"Vi faccio vedere *io* chi sono *io*!! *Io* vi compro la fabbrica e
*tutto*!!"
~ Scrooge, from I TL 174-A
the Gemstone's letter columns, so if I say something I've already said,
that's the reason)
Walt Disney Comics and Stories #634
- DD The Hard Boiled Duck: I hadn't liked much this story when it had been
published on Zio Paperone last November... but now I liked it! I guess that
Van Horn's dialogs are much better in English than they are in Italian
(still I can't say I like his art, but that's a matter of taste of course).
- MM Checkmate: Nothing particular, I don't generally like the use of the
Phantom Blot in short stories like this. Is the Big Bad, and so he should be
used in my opinion.
- GL Party of none!: I liked this one (even though I've grown a bit tired of
Vicar's late stories, I think his lost the touch he had when he drew stories
like the one with the Klondike pipeline, my favorite of his). It was nice to
see Glastone out of luck, even though I think we've already seen him in
similar conditions a thousand of times.
- JW New Zoo Brews Ado: I'm not a big fan of these Jippes' remakes, even
though they're much better than the original ones, but since they exist I
think they must be published, since Barks deserves to be published!
Walt Disney Comics and Stories #635
- JW Hound of Moaning Hills: Same as the above (but I liked this one more).
Weird thing: at the same time it was published in Italy, last month on Zio
Paperone.
- MM Spidermouse: Please no Mickey meets Peter Parker stories!
- DD The 3 Caballeros Ride Again: Rosa in English is always a pleasure to
read! Even if I don't like the 3 Caballeros (but I like the story, that I'd
already read in Italian)
Uncle Scrooge 319
- US The Duchman's Secret: Now *this* is fun! One of my favourite Rosa
stories in English, that's something! Great story, and great ending, always
loved the way Scrooge gets the crook jailed. And great idea to have an
article by him explaining some things about the story!
- US Worldwide Widgets: How strange to see Fethry in an American Comic Book.
But a good thing, I hope to see more of him, maybe some classical story by
Kinney and Hubbard! (Or by Pezzin and Cavazzano)
- DD Terror of the Beagle Boys: There always has to be some Barks of course,
even though we've already read all of his stories one thousand times. I just
wonder, how come the story looks so strange? It seems that it comes from and
actual old printing of it, and not from the original... I don't know how
they're called in English, "prints"?
Uncle Scrooge 320
- US Fools of the Trade: This one too is better in English, but I'm not a
big fan of Van Horn's art (while I'm becoming fan of his writing)
- US The Big Break-In: FINALLY some Scarpa back in the US! The story is just
a short S-coded story, not written by him, so it's nothing special, but the
art is great! (Even though I see there's something wrong with the inks of
this printing... no problems in my Italian editions of the same story, what
happened here?)
- GG The Madball Pitcher: Another Barks here, very nice, but the printing is
as the above... huh?
- US World Wide Witch: This story have caused a lot of talk... me I like it,
I find it's a nice story... not a masterpiece at all, but decent and nice
and funny, what a short non-pretencious story should be. I was also happy to
see the article by Blum himself explaining stuff... good job. (Articles are
always good, the more, the better)
Donald Duck Adventures 1
(This was a little surprise!)
- DD The Deep: Now, how creepy was this? I really loved this one, what a
surprise! Authors completely unknown to me... nice art, better than the
average) and nice plot!
- MM Panicking Pachiderms: well, nice one! Nothing special, but nice after
all.
- US Time of Reckoning: same here... even though I've seen thousands of
stories like this in Italy on "Topolino"...
So far I'm satisfied of what I'm getting. They're a bit expensive to tell
the truth, but nothing can be done for this, I know.
What I'd like to see in the future:
First I hope that it'll last much longer than Gladstone... possibly
indefinitely! How's it *really* going economically, anybody knows? Geppi
keeps buying expensive stuff at various auctions, is this a good sign? ;-)
Anyway, I was saying:
- Everything by Don Rosa: they were written in English and the only way to
really appreciate them deeply is to read them in English, so let them come!
- Stories written and drawn by Romano Scarpa: there are so many classical
stories from the Fifties (Both Ducks and Mice!) not published by
Gladstone... each one of them should be published in a nice edition and with
a good translation (possibily without "barks-in' 'em up" as it happenned
with the "Colossus of Rhodes" years ago... if there are no references to
Barks in a story let's not make them up, that's my opinion). Since there is
now this new pocket "Take-Along" comic book, it seems to me that it would be
the best place where to publish Scarpa (or any Italian 3-tiered stories), so
there would be no need to remount 3-tiers into 4-tiers.
I'd also love to see Scarpa's more recent (From the Seventies on) Mickey
stories, featuring Ellsworth's stepson... they're all part of a real
continuity so they should be published in order. These includes 4 strip
stories made at the beginning of the Ninenties, (really wonderful stuff) and
the 8-parter "Paperolimpiadi" starring both Ducks and Mice made in 1988 for
the Seoul Olympics, a true masterpiece.
- Anything by Gottfredson: he's still so little known in the US compared to
Barks, while he should be known by anyone. I guess the problem here is the
strip format... I wouldn't really know how to do, since I'd hate to have to
remount the strips, but... any affordable alternatives?
- Other Italian stuff: Lots. But most of all I'd love to see Massimo De
Vita's fantasy "Ice Sword Trilogy", undoubtedly the masterpiece of this
great Italian artist. It'd be great (and also almost impossible) to see
"Storia e Gloria della Dinastia dei Paperi" ("History and Glory of the
Ducks' Dynasty", and 8-part story made in 1971 by Guido Martina, Romano
Scarpa and Giovan Battista Carpi about the history of the Ducks, starting
from the ancient Egypt. Completely non-Barksian, since Scrooge, for example,
is born in Klondike, but I don't care much, since it's really fascinating).
And stories by Giorgio Cavazzano, Massimo De Vita, Luciano Bottaro, Giovan
Battista Carpi, Silvia Ziche and many others... Oh I was forgetting: the
recent "Bay Stories" written by Alberto Savini, probably the nicest thing
made in Italy in the latest years.
I guess that's all. What do you all think about it so far?
--
Francesco
http://www.dimensionedelta.net/scarpa/
"Vi faccio vedere *io* chi sono *io*!! *Io* vi compro la fabbrica e
*tutto*!!"
~ Scrooge, from I TL 174-A
Sigvald Grøsfjeld Jr.
Imperatore della Calidornia + The Italian Duck universe
Message 415 -
2003-08-17 at 19:56:27
Olaf Solstrand <olaf at andebyonline.com> wrote:
>> Sigvald:
>> Second I do differ between *adding* new
>> characters like Arpine L?sene, Jos? Carioca,
>> Panchito Pistoles, etc. (who really don't
>> contradict Barks' universe), and *changes of
>> what I would like to call constants in Barks'
>> universe like the look of he Money Bin, the
>> look of Scrooge's secretary, the fact that
>> $crooge normally doesn't have a butler, etc.
>
> And still, you reacted to Battista and
> Brigitta?
I like them, but I also realises that AFAIK they have never been a part of
the American Duck-universe.
> Well, Barks _HAS_ shown Scrooge with a butler.
> OK, that was a cover, but... we have also in
> several stories seen Scrooge surround himself
> with "servants". Perhaps no butlers, but quite
> a selection of chauffeurs. As for sources, I
> don't have them, but I have a feeling that
> Daniel can dig up a few of them if you need
> them.
No, he don't need to do that for me.
> Also, Battista fits Scrooge perfectly. He has
> practically no salary and no vacations... and
> still, he saves a lot of money for Scrooge
> with his clever tricks to press down the
> prices. His nature fits Scrooge perfectly,
> like no other butler would. More than a butler,
> he's something that helps Scrooge to spend less
> money.
Seems correct.
> And, when it comes to Brigitta: What's so
> disrespectful in showing that Scrooge
> has an admirer? He's the richest duck in the
> world, so anything else would be strange.
> Brigitta McBridge does most certainly not
> contradict anything Barks has written!
Well, AFAIK he *never* showed any such admirer of $crooge. Anyway, I guess
that Katie kan tell us more about this - as she's AFAIK DCMLs expert on THIS
particular topic.
> (by the way, I notice you use the Norwegian
> names for Italian characters. You call
> Battista "James" and Trudy "Petra". That is
> fine with me, but not everybody here read
> their comics in Norwegian, so could we please
> use original names? Especially since you tend
> to grumble when OTHERS don't use INDUCKS to
> dig up original names?)
Please remember that Coa was recently down for some time so I had no access.
Besides I do like the Norwegian names much better - "James" sounds perfect
for a butler, and "Petra" fits IMO very well together with Pete - just like
Mickey and Minnie or Donald and Daisy...
> --------------------------
>
> And now for something completely different:
>
> I was just reading "Topolino Imperatore
> della Calidornia" (I TL 274-A) in a Norwegian
> Donald Pocket, and noticed what MUST have been
> an error: Timing.
>
> According to the contract shown in the end,
> this story takes place in August 1973. Occuring
> in this story is an old criminal (Norwegian
> name "T?ffe-Mikke") who says he's 104 years
> old... but this same criminal is occuring in
> a flashback where he was shown to be a very
> active criminal... and that was in 1880. So
> in 1880 he must have been 13 years old -
> which the flashback shows very clearly in my
> opinion that he isn't.
>
> So, this is probably an error made by someone
> - my question is who. Did Scarpa do this, or
> was this error done in Norwegian translation
> because the translators changed the year
> without concidering the concequences, WAS
> this criminal actually 13 years old, or is
> there something completely different that
> can explain this?
>
> My first question would have to be: What years
> and age were used in the Italian original?
>
> Well, I now see that this story was first
> published in 1961, so I assume this story
> had a 1960 or 1961 date instead of "September
> 1st 1973", and that all other years and ages
> were the same, so that "T?ffe-Mikke" would
> have been 25 years old in 1880. But I have to
> ask anyhow... One of the reasons I puzzle, is
> that this "T?ffe-Mikke" seems to be appr.
> the same age in 1880 as Mickey is today.
> In other words, this calculation COULD BE an
> indicator on Scarpa's thoughts of Mickey's age.
>
> If anyone thinks I'm overreacting... I'm just
> curious. I like calculating these things, and
> laughed a little at this funny detail... But
> I'm curious where in the process this happened.
My guess that this mess i caused by Egmont's/ Disney's policy that a story
takes place when it's published. For the same reason some publisher's made a
mess out of the chronology given in panel #1 in Gyro's First Invention, etc.
> Best,
> Olaf the Blue
PS! Olaf sent this mail to me only and later asked me to farwrd it to DCML.
Sigvald
>> Sigvald:
>> Second I do differ between *adding* new
>> characters like Arpine L?sene, Jos? Carioca,
>> Panchito Pistoles, etc. (who really don't
>> contradict Barks' universe), and *changes of
>> what I would like to call constants in Barks'
>> universe like the look of he Money Bin, the
>> look of Scrooge's secretary, the fact that
>> $crooge normally doesn't have a butler, etc.
>
> And still, you reacted to Battista and
> Brigitta?
I like them, but I also realises that AFAIK they have never been a part of
the American Duck-universe.
> Well, Barks _HAS_ shown Scrooge with a butler.
> OK, that was a cover, but... we have also in
> several stories seen Scrooge surround himself
> with "servants". Perhaps no butlers, but quite
> a selection of chauffeurs. As for sources, I
> don't have them, but I have a feeling that
> Daniel can dig up a few of them if you need
> them.
No, he don't need to do that for me.
> Also, Battista fits Scrooge perfectly. He has
> practically no salary and no vacations... and
> still, he saves a lot of money for Scrooge
> with his clever tricks to press down the
> prices. His nature fits Scrooge perfectly,
> like no other butler would. More than a butler,
> he's something that helps Scrooge to spend less
> money.
Seems correct.
> And, when it comes to Brigitta: What's so
> disrespectful in showing that Scrooge
> has an admirer? He's the richest duck in the
> world, so anything else would be strange.
> Brigitta McBridge does most certainly not
> contradict anything Barks has written!
Well, AFAIK he *never* showed any such admirer of $crooge. Anyway, I guess
that Katie kan tell us more about this - as she's AFAIK DCMLs expert on THIS
particular topic.
> (by the way, I notice you use the Norwegian
> names for Italian characters. You call
> Battista "James" and Trudy "Petra". That is
> fine with me, but not everybody here read
> their comics in Norwegian, so could we please
> use original names? Especially since you tend
> to grumble when OTHERS don't use INDUCKS to
> dig up original names?)
Please remember that Coa was recently down for some time so I had no access.
Besides I do like the Norwegian names much better - "James" sounds perfect
for a butler, and "Petra" fits IMO very well together with Pete - just like
Mickey and Minnie or Donald and Daisy...
> --------------------------
>
> And now for something completely different:
>
> I was just reading "Topolino Imperatore
> della Calidornia" (I TL 274-A) in a Norwegian
> Donald Pocket, and noticed what MUST have been
> an error: Timing.
>
> According to the contract shown in the end,
> this story takes place in August 1973. Occuring
> in this story is an old criminal (Norwegian
> name "T?ffe-Mikke") who says he's 104 years
> old... but this same criminal is occuring in
> a flashback where he was shown to be a very
> active criminal... and that was in 1880. So
> in 1880 he must have been 13 years old -
> which the flashback shows very clearly in my
> opinion that he isn't.
>
> So, this is probably an error made by someone
> - my question is who. Did Scarpa do this, or
> was this error done in Norwegian translation
> because the translators changed the year
> without concidering the concequences, WAS
> this criminal actually 13 years old, or is
> there something completely different that
> can explain this?
>
> My first question would have to be: What years
> and age were used in the Italian original?
>
> Well, I now see that this story was first
> published in 1961, so I assume this story
> had a 1960 or 1961 date instead of "September
> 1st 1973", and that all other years and ages
> were the same, so that "T?ffe-Mikke" would
> have been 25 years old in 1880. But I have to
> ask anyhow... One of the reasons I puzzle, is
> that this "T?ffe-Mikke" seems to be appr.
> the same age in 1880 as Mickey is today.
> In other words, this calculation COULD BE an
> indicator on Scarpa's thoughts of Mickey's age.
>
> If anyone thinks I'm overreacting... I'm just
> curious. I like calculating these things, and
> laughed a little at this funny detail... But
> I'm curious where in the process this happened.
My guess that this mess i caused by Egmont's/ Disney's policy that a story
takes place when it's published. For the same reason some publisher's made a
mess out of the chronology given in panel #1 in Gyro's First Invention, etc.
> Best,
> Olaf the Blue
PS! Olaf sent this mail to me only and later asked me to farwrd it to DCML.
Sigvald
Sigvald Grøsfjeld Jr.
The Italian Duck universe
Message 416 -
2003-08-17 at 20:31:40
Daniel van Eijmeren <dve at kabelfoon.nl> wrote:
> No, you are referring to the ROSA UNIVERSE,
> once again...
>
> In Barks's universe, these points are no
> constant "facts" at all:
> - Scrooge has many different money bins, like
> the egg shaped one in the super-strong
> forbidium money bin story (DISBP 1)
Just a one-time fenomenon.
> and the Money Bin at a Duckburg street. (The
> Golden River, US 22.)
The downtown "bin" also exist in Rosa's interpretation of the Duck universe.
Just take a look in "The Pied Piper of Duckburg".
> - Scrooge has different secretaries and clerks
Correct, but unlike Ms Quackfaster they are *not* regular characters.
> - Scrooge has a mansion and a butler
Only in "Christmas on Bear Mountain". He sold it shortly after, early 1948 I
would guess - just read the end of Lo$.
>> However monumental tales about the life and
>> history of characters in the Duck universe
>> should IMHO be based on the original Duck
>> universe ? not its nice twin.
>
> Know what you say. The Rosa universe should
> also be ignored then! It's not original.
> It's a retrospective universe, with exceptions
> to the "original" universe. These exceptions
> are even a proof that the "original" universe
> was not intended to be structured in
> retrospective at all. So, why force them
> together into one jar?
Don Rosa's Duck universe is one version of the original American Duck
universe. I can't see the problem here?
> And... even Barks *himself* adjusted his Ducks
> to what other Disney artists did, at the time
> when he was *creating* the "Barks universe".
OK
> (Please Sigvald, I don't want to go through
> this again. Do you?)
No, I guess that enough has been said about this topic now.
> Can't we just all agree that different artists
> have different styles and opinions?
Off course they have.
> And that it's not up to you - or me - to tell
> which style and opinion is superior or
> inferior? Or do you like to *hurt* people by
> suggesting that your opinion is superior?
No I don't. I think however that what often have made me react is when
people for some reason seems to completely ignore Don Rosa's explanations
for things in the Duck-universe - even without explaining why they do so.
You may ask why I keep thinking that Don Rosa is so important. The reasons
for that is that Don has put a lot of effort in explaining many important
sides of the Duck-universe, like when and how Scrooge raised his Money Bin,
how the Ducks is related, how HD&L joined TJW, how Little Helper was
created, etc - and always by staying faithful to Barks. Even though this
*don't* make Don a guru, it still IMO makes him important.
> That's what you're doing when you write that
> way, because you're attacking their enthusiasm
> for interpreting comics in their own way and
> taste. And when people feel attacked they can
> get very defensive and angry. This results in
> flaming, and a bad atmosphere. End result is
> a downward spiral in which NOBODY - including
> you - is enjoying this mailing list and their
> comics anymore.
This sounds very plausible.
> So, be more tolerant and positive towards
> others. It's also for your own good.
I think that we all should be. Remember that I am not the only one that have
presented "Theorys" as they were "facts". One example is people who claim
that the Ducks in Duckburg were hatched from eggs, even though that's a hot
potato whenever it comes up here in DCML.
> A world in which people even hurt each other's
> fantasies and dreams, is no better than hell.
> Let's keep that pain and suffering out of our
> little idyllic DCML-garden. Okay?
Sounds like a very good idea!
Sigvald
> No, you are referring to the ROSA UNIVERSE,
> once again...
>
> In Barks's universe, these points are no
> constant "facts" at all:
> - Scrooge has many different money bins, like
> the egg shaped one in the super-strong
> forbidium money bin story (DISBP 1)
Just a one-time fenomenon.
> and the Money Bin at a Duckburg street. (The
> Golden River, US 22.)
The downtown "bin" also exist in Rosa's interpretation of the Duck universe.
Just take a look in "The Pied Piper of Duckburg".
> - Scrooge has different secretaries and clerks
Correct, but unlike Ms Quackfaster they are *not* regular characters.
> - Scrooge has a mansion and a butler
Only in "Christmas on Bear Mountain". He sold it shortly after, early 1948 I
would guess - just read the end of Lo$.
>> However monumental tales about the life and
>> history of characters in the Duck universe
>> should IMHO be based on the original Duck
>> universe ? not its nice twin.
>
> Know what you say. The Rosa universe should
> also be ignored then! It's not original.
> It's a retrospective universe, with exceptions
> to the "original" universe. These exceptions
> are even a proof that the "original" universe
> was not intended to be structured in
> retrospective at all. So, why force them
> together into one jar?
Don Rosa's Duck universe is one version of the original American Duck
universe. I can't see the problem here?
> And... even Barks *himself* adjusted his Ducks
> to what other Disney artists did, at the time
> when he was *creating* the "Barks universe".
OK
> (Please Sigvald, I don't want to go through
> this again. Do you?)
No, I guess that enough has been said about this topic now.
> Can't we just all agree that different artists
> have different styles and opinions?
Off course they have.
> And that it's not up to you - or me - to tell
> which style and opinion is superior or
> inferior? Or do you like to *hurt* people by
> suggesting that your opinion is superior?
No I don't. I think however that what often have made me react is when
people for some reason seems to completely ignore Don Rosa's explanations
for things in the Duck-universe - even without explaining why they do so.
You may ask why I keep thinking that Don Rosa is so important. The reasons
for that is that Don has put a lot of effort in explaining many important
sides of the Duck-universe, like when and how Scrooge raised his Money Bin,
how the Ducks is related, how HD&L joined TJW, how Little Helper was
created, etc - and always by staying faithful to Barks. Even though this
*don't* make Don a guru, it still IMO makes him important.
> That's what you're doing when you write that
> way, because you're attacking their enthusiasm
> for interpreting comics in their own way and
> taste. And when people feel attacked they can
> get very defensive and angry. This results in
> flaming, and a bad atmosphere. End result is
> a downward spiral in which NOBODY - including
> you - is enjoying this mailing list and their
> comics anymore.
This sounds very plausible.
> So, be more tolerant and positive towards
> others. It's also for your own good.
I think that we all should be. Remember that I am not the only one that have
presented "Theorys" as they were "facts". One example is people who claim
that the Ducks in Duckburg were hatched from eggs, even though that's a hot
potato whenever it comes up here in DCML.
> A world in which people even hurt each other's
> fantasies and dreams, is no better than hell.
> Let's keep that pain and suffering out of our
> little idyllic DCML-garden. Okay?
Sounds like a very good idea!
Sigvald
Francesco Spreafico
Imperatore della Calidornia + The Italian Duck universe
Message 417 -
2003-08-17 at 20:45:20
Sigvald Gr?sfjeld jr. wrote:
> I like them, but I also realises that AFAIK they have never been a
> part of the American Duck-universe.
Well, Barks once made a sketch featuring Brigitta, maybe this makes it part
of the American Duck-universe even for you 8-)
On to Olaf:
>> According to the contract shown in the end,
>> this story takes place in August 1973.
Changed in the reprints (it happens even in my 1995 reprint, it has 1995.
Originally it was 1961.
>> Well, I now see that this story was first
>> published in 1961, so I assume this story
>> had a 1960 or 1961 date instead of "September
>> 1st 1973", and that all other years and ages
>> were the same, so that "T?ffe-Mikke" would
>> have been 25 years old in 1880. But I have to
>> ask anyhow... One of the reasons I puzzle, is
>> that this "T?ffe-Mikke" seems to be appr.
>> the same age in 1880 as Mickey is today.
>> In other words, this calculation COULD BE an
>> indicator on Scarpa's thoughts of Mickey's age.
I remember Mickey saying he's 25 in a 1953 story (so he was born in 1928...
of course!) but it was written by Guido Martina.
--
Francesco
http://www.dimensionedelta.net/scarpa/
"Vi faccio vedere *io* chi sono *io*!! *Io* vi compro la fabbrica e
*tutto*!!"
~ Scrooge, from I TL 174-A
> I like them, but I also realises that AFAIK they have never been a
> part of the American Duck-universe.
Well, Barks once made a sketch featuring Brigitta, maybe this makes it part
of the American Duck-universe even for you 8-)
On to Olaf:
>> According to the contract shown in the end,
>> this story takes place in August 1973.
Changed in the reprints (it happens even in my 1995 reprint, it has 1995.
Originally it was 1961.
>> Well, I now see that this story was first
>> published in 1961, so I assume this story
>> had a 1960 or 1961 date instead of "September
>> 1st 1973", and that all other years and ages
>> were the same, so that "T?ffe-Mikke" would
>> have been 25 years old in 1880. But I have to
>> ask anyhow... One of the reasons I puzzle, is
>> that this "T?ffe-Mikke" seems to be appr.
>> the same age in 1880 as Mickey is today.
>> In other words, this calculation COULD BE an
>> indicator on Scarpa's thoughts of Mickey's age.
I remember Mickey saying he's 25 in a 1953 story (so he was born in 1928...
of course!) but it was written by Guido Martina.
--
Francesco
http://www.dimensionedelta.net/scarpa/
"Vi faccio vedere *io* chi sono *io*!! *Io* vi compro la fabbrica e
*tutto*!!"
~ Scrooge, from I TL 174-A
Sigvald Grøsfjeld Jr.
What old stories do YOU want to see in print again?
Message 418 -
2003-08-17 at 21:16:03
Hi all!
Disney comics has been printed for almost 75 years now, in many languages.
Some stories have been republished many times, other stories haven't seen
print for many decades or have for some reason never been printed in your
language. I guess most, if not all, of us have old and not so old favourites
that we would like to see in print again in order to complete our
collection, just to see those stories in a nicer print or what-so-ever. Here
I will present my 10 on top list. Please feel free follow up with you own
lists.
Sigvald's top-10 list of stories wanted in Norwegian print:
1. H 87173 ? "DA: Forget Me Not" (Rosa/Straatman)
2. I TES 3-1 "DD. Somewhere in Nowhere" (Barks/ Lustig/ Block)
3. "MM sails for Treasure Island" ? 1932(Gottredson/Taliaferro)
4. "MM and The Bat Bandit of Inferno Gulch" ? 1934
(Gottfredson/Osborne/Twaits)
5. "MM and Bobo the Elephant" ? 1934 (Gottfredson/Osborne/Twaits)
6. "MM Supersalesman" ? 1941 (Gottfredson/Maris/Wright)
7. WDC313-WDC316 ? "MM: The Treasure of Oomba Loomba" (Murry/Gottfredson)
8. WDC 239 ? "DD: The Willage Blacksmith" (Barks)
9. U$71 ? "U$: King $crooge the first" (Barks/Strobl)
10. K DTM90i ? "DT: Back in Time for a Dime" (Rosa/JD Studios)
Sigvald
Disney comics has been printed for almost 75 years now, in many languages.
Some stories have been republished many times, other stories haven't seen
print for many decades or have for some reason never been printed in your
language. I guess most, if not all, of us have old and not so old favourites
that we would like to see in print again in order to complete our
collection, just to see those stories in a nicer print or what-so-ever. Here
I will present my 10 on top list. Please feel free follow up with you own
lists.
Sigvald's top-10 list of stories wanted in Norwegian print:
1. H 87173 ? "DA: Forget Me Not" (Rosa/Straatman)
2. I TES 3-1 "DD. Somewhere in Nowhere" (Barks/ Lustig/ Block)
3. "MM sails for Treasure Island" ? 1932(Gottredson/Taliaferro)
4. "MM and The Bat Bandit of Inferno Gulch" ? 1934
(Gottfredson/Osborne/Twaits)
5. "MM and Bobo the Elephant" ? 1934 (Gottfredson/Osborne/Twaits)
6. "MM Supersalesman" ? 1941 (Gottfredson/Maris/Wright)
7. WDC313-WDC316 ? "MM: The Treasure of Oomba Loomba" (Murry/Gottfredson)
8. WDC 239 ? "DD: The Willage Blacksmith" (Barks)
9. U$71 ? "U$: King $crooge the first" (Barks/Strobl)
10. K DTM90i ? "DT: Back in Time for a Dime" (Rosa/JD Studios)
Sigvald
Olaf Solstrand
Imperatore della Calidornia + The Italian Duck universe
Message 419 -
2003-08-17 at 22:28:36
Francesco:
> > According to the contract shown in the end,
> > this story takes place in August 1973.
>
> Changed in the reprints (it happens even in my 1995 reprint, it has
> 1995. Originally it was 1961.
I expected that... I wonder what a reprint of Mazzanti/Gatto's "Paperino...
Anno 2001" (I TL 309-A) would look like! :-) They can't change a year that's
mentioned in the story's title, can they? "Donald, I'm sending you back to the
past to find out what your future will be like..." "You still have a gas-driven
engine? We quit using those in 1980!" Look out, Doc and Marty, here we come!
On to Sigvald...
> [me:]
> > Brigitta McBridge does most certainly not
> > contradict anything Barks has written!
>
> Well, AFAIK he *never* showed any such admirer of $crooge.
But he never stated that Scrooge did NOT have such an admirer either. Please...
Are you saying that NO kinds of characters should be allowed unless Carl Barks
has shown anything like it? So... If I wrote a story about a coin collector
with huge nostrils, you would respond to this as disrespect because "according
to Carl Barks, there ARE no coin collectors with huge nostrils in Duckburg"?
Only because Barks never showed any coin collectors with huge nostrils? Well,
that is SILLY!
> Please remember that Coa was recently down for some time so I had no access.
> Besides I do like the Norwegian names much better - "James" sounds perfect
> for a butler, and "Petra" fits IMO very well together with Pete - just like
> Mickey and Minnie or Donald and Daisy...
Hmm... sounds... logical... Hey, guess what! I like "Florence" better
than "Emily"! "Florence" sounds perfect for an old secretary, and the first
name "Florence" fits IMO very well together with the last name "Quackfaster"!
> [Daniel:]
> > - Scrooge has a mansion and a butler
>
> Only in "Christmas on Bear Mountain". He sold it shortly after, early
> 1948 I would guess - just read the end of Lo$.
You're mixing your name cards again, Sigvald. Lo$ was NOT written by Carl
Barks. Carl Barks NEVER wrote anything about Scrooge selling his mansion, and
as far as I remember he never wrote anything about Scrooge living other places
either. (And please don't mention Rosa's "The Beagle Boys vs. The Money Bin",
or I will come down to Stavanger and slap you around a bit with a large trout!)
Please, Sigvald - Carl Barks is Carl Barks, Don Rosa is Don Rosa! How hard is
it to tell the difference?
> Don Rosa's Duck universe is one version of the original American Duck
> universe. I can't see the problem here?
Aw! Sorry for being plain RUDE, but... what? Do you think of Barks' opinions
and Rosa's opinions as one because they are both Americans? So, Rosa can
develop Barks' universe as much as he like, but the Italians can't? Isn't that
a little... racist? TRUE, Don Rosa is working on Carl Barks' universe, not on
the one developed by [other] Italians. But he still develops/changes quite a
lot of it. Yes, he is American. SO WHAT? You can compare Don Rosa's stories to
William Van Horn's or Geoffrey Blum's. They're all Americans. They're all the
same, then?
> You may ask why I keep thinking that Don Rosa is so important.
> The reasons for that is that Don has put a lot of effort in
> explaining many important sides of the Duck-universe, like when
> and how Scrooge raised his Money Bin, how the Ducks is related,
> how HD&L joined TJW, how Little Helper was created, etc - and
> always by staying faithful to Barks. Even though this
> *don't* make Don a guru, it still IMO makes him important.
Ah... You just make it sound as if all other writers don't give a damn.
Hugs and kisses,
Olaf the Blue
> > According to the contract shown in the end,
> > this story takes place in August 1973.
>
> Changed in the reprints (it happens even in my 1995 reprint, it has
> 1995. Originally it was 1961.
I expected that... I wonder what a reprint of Mazzanti/Gatto's "Paperino...
Anno 2001" (I TL 309-A) would look like! :-) They can't change a year that's
mentioned in the story's title, can they? "Donald, I'm sending you back to the
past to find out what your future will be like..." "You still have a gas-driven
engine? We quit using those in 1980!" Look out, Doc and Marty, here we come!
On to Sigvald...
> [me:]
> > Brigitta McBridge does most certainly not
> > contradict anything Barks has written!
>
> Well, AFAIK he *never* showed any such admirer of $crooge.
But he never stated that Scrooge did NOT have such an admirer either. Please...
Are you saying that NO kinds of characters should be allowed unless Carl Barks
has shown anything like it? So... If I wrote a story about a coin collector
with huge nostrils, you would respond to this as disrespect because "according
to Carl Barks, there ARE no coin collectors with huge nostrils in Duckburg"?
Only because Barks never showed any coin collectors with huge nostrils? Well,
that is SILLY!
> Please remember that Coa was recently down for some time so I had no access.
> Besides I do like the Norwegian names much better - "James" sounds perfect
> for a butler, and "Petra" fits IMO very well together with Pete - just like
> Mickey and Minnie or Donald and Daisy...
Hmm... sounds... logical... Hey, guess what! I like "Florence" better
than "Emily"! "Florence" sounds perfect for an old secretary, and the first
name "Florence" fits IMO very well together with the last name "Quackfaster"!
> [Daniel:]
> > - Scrooge has a mansion and a butler
>
> Only in "Christmas on Bear Mountain". He sold it shortly after, early
> 1948 I would guess - just read the end of Lo$.
You're mixing your name cards again, Sigvald. Lo$ was NOT written by Carl
Barks. Carl Barks NEVER wrote anything about Scrooge selling his mansion, and
as far as I remember he never wrote anything about Scrooge living other places
either. (And please don't mention Rosa's "The Beagle Boys vs. The Money Bin",
or I will come down to Stavanger and slap you around a bit with a large trout!)
Please, Sigvald - Carl Barks is Carl Barks, Don Rosa is Don Rosa! How hard is
it to tell the difference?
> Don Rosa's Duck universe is one version of the original American Duck
> universe. I can't see the problem here?
Aw! Sorry for being plain RUDE, but... what? Do you think of Barks' opinions
and Rosa's opinions as one because they are both Americans? So, Rosa can
develop Barks' universe as much as he like, but the Italians can't? Isn't that
a little... racist? TRUE, Don Rosa is working on Carl Barks' universe, not on
the one developed by [other] Italians. But he still develops/changes quite a
lot of it. Yes, he is American. SO WHAT? You can compare Don Rosa's stories to
William Van Horn's or Geoffrey Blum's. They're all Americans. They're all the
same, then?
> You may ask why I keep thinking that Don Rosa is so important.
> The reasons for that is that Don has put a lot of effort in
> explaining many important sides of the Duck-universe, like when
> and how Scrooge raised his Money Bin, how the Ducks is related,
> how HD&L joined TJW, how Little Helper was created, etc - and
> always by staying faithful to Barks. Even though this
> *don't* make Don a guru, it still IMO makes him important.
Ah... You just make it sound as if all other writers don't give a damn.
Hugs and kisses,
Olaf the Blue
Daniel Van Eijmeren
Sigvald's universe
Message 420 -
2003-08-17 at 23:17:48
SIGVALD GROSFJELD to me, 17-08-2003:
>> No, you are referring to the ROSA UNIVERSE, once again...
>> In Barks's universe, these points are no constant "facts" at all:
>> - Scrooge has many different money bins, like the egg shaped one
>> in the super-strong forbidium money bin story (DISBP 1)
> Just a one-time fenomenon.
So what? Glittering Goldie also is a one-time Barks fenomenon.
>> and the Money Bin at a Duckburg street. (The Golden River, US 22.)
> The downtown "bin" also exist in Rosa's interpretation of the
> Duck universe. Just take a look in "The Pied Piper of Duckburg".
That story is based on an unfinished Carl Barks story, in which the
downtown money bin is shown.
For your interest: In Barks's cannonball story (WDC 134), Scrooge
literally calls his downtown safe a money bin.
>> - Scrooge has different secretaries and clerks
> Correct, but unlike Ms Quackfaster they are *not* regular
> characters.
Barks has used Miss Quackfaster only once. In "A Spicy Tale" (US 39).
The so-called debut story "The Midas Touch" (US 36) doesn't mention
her at all. It can be easily be discussed that lady is someone else.
>> - Scrooge has a mansion and a butler
> Only in "Christmas on Bear Mountain". He sold it shortly after,
> early 1948 I would guess - just read the end of Lo$.
You just don't want to get it, or you are just trolling. Or both.
The "Life of Scrooge" is a ROSA series, based on ROSA'S VISION.
>> And that it's not up to you - or me - to tell which style and
>> opinion is superior or inferior? Or do you like to *hurt* people
>> by suggesting that your opinion is superior?
> No I don't. I think however that what often have made me react is
> when people for some reason seems to completely ignore Don Rosa's
> explanations for things in the Duck-universe -
Sigvald, there are people in this universe who call themselves serious
readers and don't care about Don Rosa's work at all. Those people may
be glad, they may be mad, they may be a little sad, (US 22) but they
do have a right to live and enjoy discussing whatever they want to,
without calling your favourite artist in order to make you happy.
There also other people in this universe who just want to write about
Disney comics, without naming your favourite artist. So, they are
not "ignoring" Don Rosa, they're just discussing other subjects.
And these people also have a right to live without being bothered by
your erroneous, obsessed contributions, full of factual mistakes and
complaints.
> even without explaining why they do so.
No one needs to explain that they don't want to discuss Rosa.
> You may ask why I keep thinking that Don Rosa is so important. The
> reasons for that is that Don has put a lot of effort in explaining
> many important sides of the Duck-universe, like when and how Scrooge
> raised his Money Bin, how the Ducks is related, how HD&L joined TJW,
> how Little Helper was created, etc - and always by staying faithful
> to Barks.
Don Rosa is not faithful to Barks's "facts".
He only is faithful to his *own* perception of Barks.
> Even though this *don't* make Don a guru, it still IMO makes him
> important.
Who says he isn't? Don Rosa indeed is *one* out of *many* important
comic book artists. That's a fact that doesn't need to be discussed.
But for 99,99999% of the comic book fans - and for people in general -
that's no reason to call "Don Rosa! Don Rosa!" on just about every
occasion. I might even suggest that you're the only person, Sigvald.
Well, unless Don Rosa has a very big mansion and a habit to be late
for dinner...
>> That's what you're doing when you write that way, because you're
>> attacking their enthusiasm for interpreting comics in their own
>> way and taste. And when people feel attacked they can get very
>> defensive and angry. This results in flaming, and a bad atmosphere.
>> End result is a downward spiral in which NOBODY - including you -
>> is enjoying this mailing list and their comics anymore.
> This sounds very plausible.
So, why do you keep going on, and on, and on, and on, and on, and on?
> Remember that I am not the only one that have presented "Theorys"
> as they were "facts". One example is people who claim that the
> Ducks in Duckburg were hatched from eggs, even though that's a hot
> potato whenever it comes up here in DCML.
You are the one cooking those hot potatoes and hot duck eggs, Sigvald.
I don't like them.
But before I deliberately ignore your favourite artist's possible
opinion on the matter, I'll hereby ask what Don Rosa thinks about
getting hot duck eggs for dinner. Don Rosa! Don Rosa! Don Rosa!
Do you like hot duck eggs for dinner, Don Rosa?
Are you happy now, Sigvald? If not, think about the higher web poll
rate that Don Rosa might get after being mentioned so many times...
>> A world in which people even hurt each other's fantasies and
>> dreams, is no better than hell. Let's keep that pain and suffering
>> out of our little idyllic DCML-garden. Okay?
> Sounds like a very good idea!
If only it could be true...
--- Dani?l
>> No, you are referring to the ROSA UNIVERSE, once again...
>> In Barks's universe, these points are no constant "facts" at all:
>> - Scrooge has many different money bins, like the egg shaped one
>> in the super-strong forbidium money bin story (DISBP 1)
> Just a one-time fenomenon.
So what? Glittering Goldie also is a one-time Barks fenomenon.
>> and the Money Bin at a Duckburg street. (The Golden River, US 22.)
> The downtown "bin" also exist in Rosa's interpretation of the
> Duck universe. Just take a look in "The Pied Piper of Duckburg".
That story is based on an unfinished Carl Barks story, in which the
downtown money bin is shown.
For your interest: In Barks's cannonball story (WDC 134), Scrooge
literally calls his downtown safe a money bin.
>> - Scrooge has different secretaries and clerks
> Correct, but unlike Ms Quackfaster they are *not* regular
> characters.
Barks has used Miss Quackfaster only once. In "A Spicy Tale" (US 39).
The so-called debut story "The Midas Touch" (US 36) doesn't mention
her at all. It can be easily be discussed that lady is someone else.
>> - Scrooge has a mansion and a butler
> Only in "Christmas on Bear Mountain". He sold it shortly after,
> early 1948 I would guess - just read the end of Lo$.
You just don't want to get it, or you are just trolling. Or both.
The "Life of Scrooge" is a ROSA series, based on ROSA'S VISION.
>> And that it's not up to you - or me - to tell which style and
>> opinion is superior or inferior? Or do you like to *hurt* people
>> by suggesting that your opinion is superior?
> No I don't. I think however that what often have made me react is
> when people for some reason seems to completely ignore Don Rosa's
> explanations for things in the Duck-universe -
Sigvald, there are people in this universe who call themselves serious
readers and don't care about Don Rosa's work at all. Those people may
be glad, they may be mad, they may be a little sad, (US 22) but they
do have a right to live and enjoy discussing whatever they want to,
without calling your favourite artist in order to make you happy.
There also other people in this universe who just want to write about
Disney comics, without naming your favourite artist. So, they are
not "ignoring" Don Rosa, they're just discussing other subjects.
And these people also have a right to live without being bothered by
your erroneous, obsessed contributions, full of factual mistakes and
complaints.
> even without explaining why they do so.
No one needs to explain that they don't want to discuss Rosa.
> You may ask why I keep thinking that Don Rosa is so important. The
> reasons for that is that Don has put a lot of effort in explaining
> many important sides of the Duck-universe, like when and how Scrooge
> raised his Money Bin, how the Ducks is related, how HD&L joined TJW,
> how Little Helper was created, etc - and always by staying faithful
> to Barks.
Don Rosa is not faithful to Barks's "facts".
He only is faithful to his *own* perception of Barks.
> Even though this *don't* make Don a guru, it still IMO makes him
> important.
Who says he isn't? Don Rosa indeed is *one* out of *many* important
comic book artists. That's a fact that doesn't need to be discussed.
But for 99,99999% of the comic book fans - and for people in general -
that's no reason to call "Don Rosa! Don Rosa!" on just about every
occasion. I might even suggest that you're the only person, Sigvald.
Well, unless Don Rosa has a very big mansion and a habit to be late
for dinner...
>> That's what you're doing when you write that way, because you're
>> attacking their enthusiasm for interpreting comics in their own
>> way and taste. And when people feel attacked they can get very
>> defensive and angry. This results in flaming, and a bad atmosphere.
>> End result is a downward spiral in which NOBODY - including you -
>> is enjoying this mailing list and their comics anymore.
> This sounds very plausible.
So, why do you keep going on, and on, and on, and on, and on, and on?
> Remember that I am not the only one that have presented "Theorys"
> as they were "facts". One example is people who claim that the
> Ducks in Duckburg were hatched from eggs, even though that's a hot
> potato whenever it comes up here in DCML.
You are the one cooking those hot potatoes and hot duck eggs, Sigvald.
I don't like them.
But before I deliberately ignore your favourite artist's possible
opinion on the matter, I'll hereby ask what Don Rosa thinks about
getting hot duck eggs for dinner. Don Rosa! Don Rosa! Don Rosa!
Do you like hot duck eggs for dinner, Don Rosa?
Are you happy now, Sigvald? If not, think about the higher web poll
rate that Don Rosa might get after being mentioned so many times...
>> A world in which people even hurt each other's fantasies and
>> dreams, is no better than hell. Let's keep that pain and suffering
>> out of our little idyllic DCML-garden. Okay?
> Sounds like a very good idea!
If only it could be true...
--- Dani?l